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Info-Atari16 Digest Vol. 91 Issue 396
Info-Atari16 Digest Wed, 17 Jul 91 Volume 91 : Issue 396
Today's Topics:
/-\- Assembly Hackings -\-/
Also problems with mega ste
bug or virus ?
Fritz and Franzen
FTP sites (2 msgs)
Hard disk backup programs
looking for a good, cheap (PD?) 68000 assembler
Need 68000 socket adapter
Portfolio in Terminator 2?
SO, WHO ASKED ME #1: The Cheapskate Factor
Spectre backups
TT compatability...
Wanted - info on Mega ST 8/16 MHz accelerators (2 msgs)
Where to get sym-ld for dbx-symbols?
XCONTROL & Mouse Accel
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: 17 Jul 91 19:25:09 GMT
From: cleveland.Freenet.Edu!aa400@ucbvax.berkeley.edu (Marc A. Lombardo)
Subject: /-\- Assembly Hackings -\-/
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
I was wondering if there was anyone out there who was really into assembly
coding and had maybe written a couple of demo screens. I am in need of
some help in coding, I am just starting to code. Also, any help getting
started using MonST would be appriciated. Using electronic mail is the
best way I can get help, please contact me through the above address
and send me sample code, etc...
I have already learned some basics on my own, like raster interrupts and
sine wave sprites, just basic stuff. I want to get into complex coding,
but I really would like some help.
Any help would be GREATLY appreciated.
--
Marc A. Lombardo User Address:aa400@cleveland.freenet.edu
/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/--/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-/-\-
Atari ST, MIDI, Music
------------------------------
Date: 17 Jul 91 14:06:35 GMT
From:
noao!ncar!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!caen!ox.com!math.fu-berlin.de!fauern!forwis
s.uni-passau.de!chekov!wieninge@arizona.edu (Christian Wieninger)
Subject: Also problems with mega ste
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
johnj@echo.philips.nl (John Janssen) writes:
>1. The first problem was that DEGAS messes up the screen, when
> you switch from menupage to drawpage. (I mean the good old
> DEGAS, not DEGAS ELITE which I didnot test).
>I got the following mail from Lars-Erik
>>Exacly the same problem I had....
>>I know of LOTS of examples of MEGA STE's with this bad chips that causes the
>>monochrome diplay to wrap when you change screen adresse and causes static in
>>the DMA sound, but Atari Corp won't confirm this and tell me that this is
>>only a problem with my machine (but you are the 4th one I've heard about).
>>Replace the chip with a chip from an old STE (not the same number so you need
>>the print-layouts for both MEGA STE and STE to do this, the chip is called
>>GSTSHIFTER and has to do with both video and sound in the STE machines..)
>>I would again like a comment on this from Atari Corp. You can't just ignore
>>this problem that applies to a great number og MEGA STE's !!!!!???
The same problem on my machine:
Switching to another screen in the DEVPAC assembler or in SPECTRUM 512
has the same effect. If Atari does not believe in that, why dont they
test it?
Where can I get the chip, that Lars-Erik described. Is this a custom chip
or any other chip.
DMA-Sound: in low resolution it`s the same on my machine. While accessing
the harddisk there is a terrible noise in the loudspeaker. In some programs
this occures also when I move the mouse.
After all these articles on the net, ATARI still claims this would be an
error only on our machines. So if anybody on this net reads about this and
if his machine works fine, could he please send a short mail?
Thank you , Christian.
------------------------------
Date: 14 Jul 91 11:28:26 GMT
From: cucstud!tfd!afp!gna!linn!Robert.Elsinga@uunet.uu.net (Robert Elsinga)
Subject: bug or virus ?
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
In a message of <04 Jul 91 13:22:57>, Frank.Moehle@arbi.informatik.uni-ol
(2:320/100.1) writes:
F> -MSGID: 2:320/100.1 287f6bf9
F> From: Frank.Moehle@arbi.informatik.uni-oldenburg.de (Frank Moehle)
F> Organization: University of Oldenburg, Germany
F>
F> I am using an ST with 2.5 MB, TOS1.4, Seagate ST157N with an ICD-
F> hostadapter
F> and a lot of stuff on it. I have been using my harddisk for a very
F> long time now, but recently my ST started behaving strage :
F>
F> I can boot from my HD, open windows and so on.
F>
F> But sometimes, after leaving a program, IT happens :
F> I return to desktop with NO open windows (I had some opened berfore
F> entering the program). As I try to open a window, the alart-box "4
F> Windows already open, please close winsdows before opening new ones"
F> (roughly translated) apears. WHY ????
F> When I select "close.." or "close window" from the menue bar, my ST
F> starts playing "dead man".
F>
F> Did I catch a virus (if so : how can I get rid of it) or is this
F> just a strage GEMDOS bug??????
I had the same 'problem', still don't know where it came from, but I have the
feeling it's a program (Tempus, Wordplus ?) that's messing things up. Does
this happen *after* using some program's, have you got new AUTO-programs
installed or ACC's? Check that out, I don't think it's a virus (all my virus
scanners couldn't find one, and I *always* boot from a clean boot-disk).
Robert Elsinga =8-)
---
Co-sysop * Atari BBS Connection * Leeuwarden NL
Robert.Elsinga@p10.f301.n282.z2.fidonet.org
or tfd.com!afp!gna!linn!p10.f301.n282.z2.fido!Robert.Elsinga
------------------------------
Date: 17 Jul 91 12:21:18 GMT
From:
noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!swrinde!cs.utexas.edu!utgpu!watserv1!watmath!ljdic
key@arizona.edu (L. J. Dickey)
Subject: Fritz and Franzen
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
Do you know where I could pick up copies of these PD software packages
from Germany? Maybe an ftp site somewhere?
I am told that they can be used to make sketches which
can then be incorportated in LaTeX source.
--
Prof L.J. Dickey, Faculty of Mathematics, U of Waterloo, Canada N2L 3G1
internet: ljdickey@watmath.UWaterloo.ca BITNET/EARN: ljdickey@watdcs
obsolescent?: ljdickey@watmath.waterloo.edu
UUCP: ljdickey@watmath.UUCP ..!uunet!watmath!ljdickey
------------------------------
Date: 17 Jul 91 06:07:13 GMT
From:
noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!sdd.hp.com!caen!uflorida!gatech!pitt!unix.cis.pitt
.edu!rjast1@arizona.edu (Robert J Anisko)
Subject: FTP sites
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
In article <9107162305.AA01173@cwns9.INS.CWRU.Edu> gpinzone@george.poly.edu
writes:
>I'm looking for a list of FTP sites that support the Atari ST.
>
>So far, all I have is the atari.archive one....
>
Here's a list of sites derived from the archive.sites.Z file found
at wuarchive.wustl.edu, using 'atari' as the keyword...
atari.archive.umich.edu 141.211.164.8 unknown
atari.archive.umich.edu 03/17/91 anonymous/odin@pilot.njin.net
cs.uni-sb.de 134.96.7.254 GNU, atari, RFCs, perl, misc
faui43.informatik.uni-erlangen.de 131.188.1.43 NeWS X11 amiga atari faces
forwiss.uni-passau.de atari st, minix, elisp, TeX
irisa.irisa.fr comp.binaries.atari.st,
irisa.irisa.fr comp.sources.atari.st,
isca01.isca.uiowa.edu comp.binaries.atari.st,
isca01.isca.uiowa.edu comp.sources.atari.st,
jyu.fi 128.214.7.5 unix, atari, amiga, mac,
mars.ee.msstate.edu 130.18.64.3 msdos, amiga, mac, atari,
nic.funet.fi mac, amiga, atari, security
rusmv1.rus.uni-stuttgart.de 129.69.1.12 RFCs, X11, atari, amiga,
slug.pws.bull.com comp.sources.atari.st,
slug.pws.bull.com comp.binaries.atari.st,
sol.cs.ruu.nl 131.211.80.5 atari, GNU, HP-UX, TeX, Perl,
star.cs.vu.nl Xserver, atari
um.cc.umich.edu 35.1.1.43 msdos, mac, apple, atari
wuarchive.wustl.edu comp.binaries.atari.st,
wuarchive.wustl.edu comp.sources.atari.st
Hope this helps...
Robert Anisko
rjast1@unix.cis.pitt.edu
------------------------------
Date: 17 Jul 91 12:31:39 GMT
From:
noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!swrinde!mips!spool.mu.edu!news.cs.indiana.edu!nstn
.ns.ca!cs.dal.ca!silvert@arizona.edu (Bill Silvert)
Subject: FTP sites
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
In <9107162305.AA01173@cwns9.INS.CWRU.Edu> al885@CWNS9.INS.CWRU.EDU (Gerard
Pinzone a.k.a. Ataru Moroboshi) writes:
>I'm looking for a list of FTP sites that support the Atari ST.
Although I don't run a formal archive, lots of ST files are available
via anonymous ftp from biome.bio.ns.ca in pub/atari-st and various
subdirectories thereof. These are mostly binary archives extracted from
postings. I don't know what most of the stuff is, so you may have to
guess from the names.
--
William Silvert, Habitat Ecology Division, Bedford Inst. of Oceanography
P. O. Box 1006, Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, CANADA B2Y 4A2. Tel. (902)426-1577
New InterNet Address: silvert@biome.bio.ns.ca
------------------------------
Date: 17 Jul 91 14:33:50 GMT
From:
noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!usc!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!wupost!waikato.ac.nz
!comp.vuw.ac.nz!actrix!Roger.Sheppard@arizona.edu (Roger Sheppard)
Subject: Hard disk backup programs
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
In article <1991Jul16.221911.27909@mailer.cc.fsu.edu> boyd@nu.cs.fsu.edu writes:
> Well, the time has come to back up my disk (I am currently running the typical
> irreplaceable-data-and-no-backup algorithm). I have seen Diamondback II and
> I also have BackupST (the one written by F. Appelman, which consists of
> backupst.ttp and bfront.prg as a front end). Now, to the questions . . .
>
> Also, can anyone recommend one product over the other? Anyone used them both?
> Mickey R. Boyd | "Kirk to Enterprise. All clear
> FSU Computer Science | down here. Beam down
> Technical Support Group | yeoman Rand and a six-pack . ."
> email: boyd@nu.cs.fsu.edu |
Well from what I have seen the HDU from Application Systems Heidelberg
would be the best one I have seen, but that was Version 2.2A,
I believe that its upto Version 3.x, very easy to use, does not use
a normal Tos format, only one file per disk, the Full Directory is
held on the Last disk, but can't be seen by Tos..
Disks do have a Tos File ID, Disk No. Partition etc.
You have complete control of the Files to back up, and Restore.
Mask/Date and Archive bit.
Uses Gem a lot.
I have seen and used most of the Otheres, what we need is for some Demos
posted to the Archive.
--
*** Roger W. Sheppard * Roger.Sheppard@bbs.actrix.gen.nz ***
*** 85 Donovan Rd * * At least I don't Flicker, not ***
*** Kapiti New Zealand.. * like a dying light globe. ! ***
------------------------------
Date: 17 Jul 91 13:44:26 GMT
From: haven.umd.edu!umbc3.umbc.edu!gmuvax2!scoile@purdue.edu (elioC evetS)
Subject: looking for a good, cheap (PD?) 68000 assembler
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
The subject about says it all. I'm looking for a good 68000 assembler,
preferably one that's inexpensive, and with good documentation. I don't need
a lot of fancy utilities, just an assembler. Anyone know of such a thing?
Steve "Stevers!" Coile scoile@gmuvax[{.BITNET|[2].gmu.edu}]
"Maturity is knowing when and where to act immature"
------------------------------
Date: 15 Jul 91 02:18:31 GMT
From: bloom-beacon!eru!hagbard!sunic!isgate!krafla!adamd@ucbvax.berkeley.edu
(Adam David)
Subject: Need 68000 socket adapter
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
In <1991Jul14.130515.20316@doug.cae.wisc.edu> carter@engr.wisc.edu (Gregory
Carter) writes:
>I have been making comments about FaST Tech's 68K 20Mhz board, and
>mainly they have been very critical.
It should at least not be allowed to overheat. 20 MHz from a 16 MHz part can
be reliable, but only under the right conditions.
>Especially since the ST is NOT at any point a stable hardware design.
>Even during periods of manufacturing the boards electrical chracteristics
>change often enough to make such a upgrade dubious.
I shall not argue whether your statement is true or not, it is simply
irrelevant. AFAIK all ST accelerator boards have one thing in common,
they communicate with the ST hardware at 8 MHz over the ST's 8 MHz CPU bus.
The ST with the upgrade will therefore be exactly as reliable as it was
before the upgrade. Of course if the upgrade itself is unreliable then
that's entirely a different story.
>I could be wrong...but I am such a know it all, that seldom occurs. :)
More often than you like to think, or does :) indicate sarcasm?
(no personal attack intended)
--
Adam David.
adamd@rhi.hi.is
------------------------------
Date: 17 Jul 91 15:37:16 GMT
From: midway!msuinfo!silver.egr.msu.edu!schultzd@mimsy.umd.edu (Count Zero
Interrupt)
Subject: Portfolio in Terminator 2?
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
This ATM/PIN stuff isn't really Atari info, BUT pin numbers ARE NOT
stored on the card. (THAT WOULD BE F***ING STUPID!)
Your account number (and sometimes your name) is stored on the card
Also, a code representing your banks node on the ATM network your
bank is a member of (There are two different major network in the US.
Although, there is some overlap.)
Later...
--
||| David W. Schultz |||
||| uunet[!rutgers!mailrus]!frith!schultzd |||
/ | \ Work Phone: (517)-353-8891 / | \
/ | \ "All I see Pornographitti, All I hear Pornographitti..." / | \
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 17 Jul 91 13:55:13 PDT
From: mfitz@tecnet1.jcte.jcs.mil
Subject: SO, WHO ASKED ME #1: The Cheapskate Factor
To: info-atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
I've owned an Atari ST for a while, and I've found the community of
users of this family of machines to be most unique and precarious.
The ST community, as most others, has its share of sycophants and
nay-sayers, zealots and whiners, paragons and parasites, geniuses and
idiots, mercenaries and victims. This variety of personalities
shapes this community in many ways.
OK, SO WHO ASKED ME?
====================
is the title of a series of essays I intend to write on "life in
the ST lane", as my time and inclination allow. It is my "two cents
worth", intended as food for thought for my fellow users. If it can
manage to raise consciousness just a little bit, then I will be able
to consider my efforts a success.
======================================================================
#1: The Cheapskate Factor
-------------------------
The Atari "Power without the Price" slogan may be eventually
considered the "original sin" of the ST community. The low cost of
the machine enticed many first-time computer-buyers into the purchase
of an ST; but as most of these folks quickly found out, the cost of a
computer system does not stop at the initial cost of the hardware.
Most first-timers are shocked at the outlay required for supplies,
accesories, and (gasp) software. Especially software; where several
choice pieces of software begin to approach the cost of purchasing
the machine itself!
I believe the main reason Atari has seen its developer base erode
is not piracy, or Atari's own incompetence at marketing (although
these are also very good reasons); but rather the perception
throughout the industry that the Atari user is _cheap_, and would
rather steal his software rather than buy it.
There is ample evidence to support this hypothesis.
For example:
1) Why have companies like WordPerfect, Practical Peripherals, and
Broderbund quit the ST field? Why did Sierra have to use _European_
sales figures to justify continued ST development for another year
(Sierra Magazine, spring '91)?
2) Why does the Amiga community have FOUR major-market magazines on
the newsstands and the ST none? Why did ST-LOG and START fail even
though they had the whole ST community to divide up between them?
The single answer to all of these questions is: user support; or
rather, lack of it. If it is perceived that we, as a community, do
not buy commercial products for our computers, then a potential
developer's, supplier's, or advertiser's attitude will be: "Why
bother?" The Amiga community, for example, is perceived as one that
buys Amiga products; therefore, the developer (a.k.a. potential
advertiser) will continue development of his product; enough revenues
can be generated from advertisers to support four magazines.
The Cheapskate attitude has persisted to this day. Why would
anyone, for example, hazard their data and programs on a floppy disk
with 80+ tracks and a _non-standard_ twisted format when a single
disk now only costs thirty to fifty cents? Why do people pirate
software on the one hand, then cry loudly about bad support for the
software that they _do_ own? Why do the loudest cries about the lack
of Atari support seem to come from people who have bought _used_
machines? Why would anyone _not_ belong to an Atari User Group?
Atari ST users must do more to support commercial software to keep
their machine viable in the marketplace. Sad to say, supporting
shareware isn't enough; such transactions are not usually visible
to the corporate types who make decisions about what products they
will produce based on what is visible within the market.
I'm not knocking computing on a shoestring, mind you; but any
budget for buying a computer should have considered software costs in
the first place. If you bought your machine to program on you should
at least have bought the package you program with. If you do mostly
wordprocessing, you should have bought the word processor; and so
on. EVERYBODY should have bought the utilities they use to maintain
their system.
We as experienced users should also consider the above when
"indoctrinating" new and potential users. The "Heck, I can get you
all the software you want for free" way to sell a new user on a
computer is an attitude that should not continue to be cultivated.
So as a final word, BUY something. BUY that telecomm program or
checkbook balancer you've been using all this time. BUY a real
version of that game program you got from some pirate that "only the
kids use anyway". Patronize your nearest dealer, if you can. We, as
users, vote for the survival of our machines in the public
marketplace with our dollars. How do _you_ vote, cheapskate?
**********************************************************************
Mike Fitz mfitz@tecnet1.jcte.jcs.mil
"All opinions above are my own"
"Kindly obtain permission from the author for reprinting this
material."
**********************************************************************
------------------------------
Date: 17 Jul 91 18:21:06 GMT
From:
noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!usc!rpi!bu.edu!bucsf.bu.edu!selick@arizona.edu
(Steven Selick)
Subject: Spectre backups
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
Has anybody found a program (mac or atari) that will back up a mac
partition in Spectre 3.0? If so, please e-mail me a copy to
<selick@bucsf.bu.edu>
------------------------------
Date: 16 Jul 91 20:31:46 GMT
From: fernwood!portal!atari!apratt@uunet.uu.net (Allan Pratt)
Subject: TT compatability...
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
ford@tardis.computer-science.edinburgh.ac.uk writes:
>Spectre GCR Well... I've got version 3.0, but I canne get it to work.. it
> locks up (as does GCRTEST) at the first try at
> accessing the floppies in GCR mode.
Mine works. Don't know what the problem might be.
>MiNT 0.8 Works fine (except for the exception handling).
Known bug, I fixed it & sent Eric the fix.
>GNU CC 1.37.1 Everything works except the preprocessor, which doesn't parse
> #if blocks properly.
Mine works -- are you SURE this is a TT/ST difference? GCC from Bammi has
always been pretty robust, and certainly has always worked fine on the TT.
It compiles itself, which is a pretty thorough test.
============================================
Opinions expressed above do not necessarily -- Allan Pratt, Atari Corp.
reflect those of Atari Corp. or anyone else. ...ames!atari!apratt
------------------------------
Date: 17 Jul 91 14:17:51 GMT
From: IFI.UIO.NO!larserio@ucbvax.berkeley.edu (LarsErikOsterud)
Subject: Wanted - info on Mega ST 8/16 MHz accelerators
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
I had a Hypercache 16 Mhz card with 8 KB cache in my MEGA ST4
Installed it my self and it worked great. It's easy to switch 8/16 too
(the earlier posted SPEED.PRG let you do it from the keyboard...)
Lars-Erik / Registered Developer / ABK-BBS +47 2132659 / ____ ______
0sterud / w/ Atari Scandinavia / larserio@ifi.uio.no / /___ /
__________/ _______________________/ ______________________/ ____/ /
------------------------------
Date: 17 Jul 91 14:23:09 GMT
From: cis.ohio-state.edu!magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!dhbutler@ucbvax.berkeley.edu
(David H Butler)
Subject: Wanted - info on Mega ST 8/16 MHz accelerators
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
This is the first person I've ever heard from that has had any
problems with ICD or AdSpeed. I can highly recomend one, I've got one myself.
It took my dealer less than 1 hour to install (25$!), and he reported that the
installation was wonderfully easy. Also, AdSpeed will switch to 8mhz.
automatically with a settup file, which I believe the MegaSTE will not do. Of
course with AdSpeed you don't get the Stereo sound etc... But neither do you
get that MegaSTE keyboard, the original MEGA keyboard is far superior, the MEGA
STE keyboard even looks cheap (I was very dissapointed, as was my local Atari
shop, so far that keyboard alone has lost them two sales, myself and an
employee of the store). I have heard rumors of the 20mhz board, and unless
there have been improvements in the 68000, they should burn out much faster
then at 16mhz, I guess it depends on how long you intend to keep your computer.
As for "most Atari's having proplems just running at 8mhz", all the speed tests
I've done show my MEGA with tos 1.2 being 99.5% as fast as the MEGA STE, so I
have no complaints. Obviously Gadgets 33mhz board does not have problems, so I
can't understand what information this comment is based on.
------------------------------
Date: 17 Jul 91 16:26:10 GMT
From:
noao!ncar!asuvax!ukma!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!ysub!psuvm!dearn!dmswwu1c!zvm055@ariz
ona.edu (U.Kuehn)
Subject: Where to get sym-ld for dbx-symbols?
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
Recently, I've got gdb in version 2.6 an d in the readme file is said, that
the older versions of sym-ld wont work, because they generate the wrong
kind of symbols. So my question: where can I get a working version of it?
Thanks in advance
Ulrich Kuehn
------------------------------
Date: 17 Jul 91 14:41:45 GMT
From:
noao!asuvax!cs.utexas.edu!sdd.hp.com!wupost!waikato.ac.nz!comp.vuw.ac.nz!actrix
!Roger.Sheppard@arizona.edu (Roger Sheppard)
Subject: XCONTROL & Mouse Accel
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
In article <2993@atari.UUCP> kbad@atari.UUCP (Ken Badertscher) writes:
>
> fischer-michael@cs.yale.edu (Michael Fischer) writes:
>
> Someone mentioned that MACCEL3 had problems with DC Showit? Hmm...
> MACCEL3 is very compatible with a lot of stuff, I'm curious what the
> conflict with Showit is...
> --
> ||| Ken Badertscher (ames!atari!kbad)
> ||| Atari R&D System Software Engine
> / | \ #include <disclaimer>
I think that was me, DC show was getting corrupted some how,
Tos error 35, if I remember, removed MACCEL3, no more problems,
I did read some thing about corruption problems on Genie some time back..
--
*** Roger W. Sheppard * Roger.Sheppard@bbs.actrix.gen.nz ***
*** 85 Donovan Rd * * At least I don't Flicker, not ***
*** Kapiti New Zealand.. * like a dying light globe. ! ***
------------------------------
End of Info-Atari16 Digest
******************************
