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Info-Atari16 Digest Vol. 91 Issue 181
Info-Atari16 Digest Sun, 31 Mar 91 Volume 91 : Issue 181
Today's Topics:
"Mr. Choi" responds to Atari
Atari Cheerleaders
Energizer Bunny (was Re: Thoughts on DC Utilities)
Jam Packer (latest version?!?)
MEGA STE INFO(Hardware Part 2) (2 msgs)
My MEGA STE
Need a cooling fan for my 1040ST with ZRAM upgrade
Standardized GEM look and feel
ST Pad specs
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: 31 Mar 91 18:32:44 GMT
From:
noao!asuvax!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!swrinde!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!van-bc!ub
c-cs!alberta!herald.usask.ca!ccu.umanitoba.ca!bright@arizona.edu (Bob Bright)
Subject: "Mr. Choi" responds to Atari
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
In article <gbx1FEm00WAw48BY40@andrew.cmu.edu> mc4c+@andrew.cmu.edu (Mark Choi)
writes:
[...]
>annoying. It is the same stupid argument made by bad actors to defend
>against bad reviews. If the critic could act, (s)he would be acting,
>(s)he would not be a critic. I do not need to have the necessary
>background in engineering or the capital to start a entrepreneurial
>venture to be able to use a machine, or to suggest improvements thereto.
Nice analogy; I've always thought art critics were a pretty useless
bunch. :-)
[...]
>bit more functional, and useful. How many people do you really believe
>are going to plop down 2 grand for this baby, and another $700-$2000 for
>another desk machine, with a lot of duplicated functionality. You seem
>to claim that one can not get a desk machine into a notebook, but the
>editors of various PC mags seem to disagree with you, putting out a
>large amount of articles about how notebooks now can be your only
>machine, are as powerful as desktops, etc.. If you wish to make personal
Well, I can't speak for others, but I haven't been the least tempted
to plop down 3 grand for a 386 "notebook" (heavy emphasis on the sneer
quotes) that weighs 3 pounds more than it should and requires lugging
around an extra 3 pounds of battery packs in order to extend the
pitifully short battery life. If doing without removable media is the
price for having a really light and useful machine, I'll be happy to
pay it. (You're not suggesting, are you, that we rely on the opinions
of the brain-dead editors of various PC mags as an indication of what
a good machine is? That's about as sensible as listening to art
critics.)
BBB
--
Bob Bright <bright@ccu.umanitoba.ca>
Dept. of Philosophy
University of Manitoba
Winnipeg, Man R3T 2N2 (204) 474-9105
------------------------------
Date: 31 Mar 91 14:02:51 GMT
From:
noao!asuvax!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!swrinde!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!unix.cis.
pitt.edu!gvlf3.gvl.unisys.com!tredysvr!cellar!darling@arizona.edu (Darling)
Subject: Atari Cheerleaders
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
trh@atari.UUCP (T R Hall) writes (somewhat ironically):
> Could it be, Mr. Choi, that you haven't the faintest idea
>what-in-the-fuck you are talking about?
[self-important ranting deleted]
> You talk about note-books equipped with hard-drives, floppies, ISA
>bus'es etc. How many NOTEBOOK (NOT laptop/luggables) machines any ALL of
these,
>or even more than ONE of these.
TRH, do you really BELIEVE this? Why don't you wake up and smell what
you're shovelling?
I'm writing this on a Dell 320N (20MHz 386SX notebook computer) that
is also 8.5"x11", and guess what? It HAS an internal 1.44MB drive.
AND a 60 MB 19ms hard drive. AND 5MB RAM. AND an internal Fax/Modem.
AND a low-power VGA edge-lit LCD that diplays 16 shades of grey. AND
a VGA monitor port. It goes on.
> In case you haven't guessed, I am REALLY annoyed with Mr. Choi's
>whinings. He doesn't take the time to find out what the machine actually is,
>yet is prepared to tear apart it's design. He doesn't take time to even
>understand our market, yet is prepared to tear apart HIS SUPPOSITIONS of our
>marketing strategy.
This sputtering attack demonstrates perfectly why Atari has so much
trouble competing in this day and age. TRH has the gall to attack
someone who theorizes about the marketing strategy (apparently having
struck a nerve), but in doing so, he demonstrates utter ignorance of
the capabilities of similar machines.
The fact that people with this lack of awareness design computers
explains A LOT about Atari's problems.
> Otherwise, why not be a reasonable human being, and make
CONSTRUCTIVE
>criticism, based on (gasp!) actual knowledge?
Like I said. Ironic, isn't it?
> Or perhaps you aren't participating in the group because of
>interest in/support for Atari?
Ah, now we see it. Anyone who doesn't kiss Atari's ass when they
commit yet another marketing blunder is automatically a heathen, is
that it?
TRH, the REAL Atari enthusiasts are those of us who acknowledge the
strengths of the machines they made before the company was infiltrated
with incompetent hacks who are completely ignorant of what's going on
in the industry, not the people who blindly accept and believe that
the company can do no wrong, and then wonder why there's no support
for their new toys.
I bought my Mega ST because, for my purposes, there was no better
choice. I can't say that about the machine you describe.
T.A.Darlington
------------------------------
Date: 31 Mar 91 20:41:05 GMT
From:
noao!asuvax!cs.utexas.edu!swrinde!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!uakari.primate.wisc
.edu!aplcen!jhunix!d_alvear@arizona.edu (Dom Alvear)
Subject: Energizer Bunny (was Re: Thoughts on DC Utilities)
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
In article <59677@aurs01.UUCP> whitcomb@aurw34.UUCP (Jonathan Whitcomb) writes:
[lots of stuff about DC Utilities deleted...]
>P.S. Last week the on the Delphi Atari weekly conference we decided
>a great hack would be to have the pink Energizer bunny come booming
>across the monitor from time to time with a digitized voice saying
>"...still going...". Sometimes across the bottom, sometimes across
>the top or up and down the sides. A DC program of the week, perhaps?
>
Have you seen NetBunny on the Macintosh? It's quite cute, but it only
runs on Mac's with 32-bit Color Quickdraw. You can set the Bunny
loose over LocalTalk and he will go across all the computers on the
net that have the NetBunny startup doc and 32-bit CoQD. Too bad the
ST doesn't have standard networking for all it's computers...
On an unrelated note, have you seen the silly DA siren? It makes a
little cop car drive across your screen with its siren on...
>
>**********************************************************************
>Jonathan Whitcomb UUCP: <whitcomb%aurgate@mcnc.org>
>Alcatel Network Systems, Raleigh, NC Delphi: JBWHIT
>
Just thought I'd add my undervalued two-cents worth... ;-)
Dom Alvear
d_alvear@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu
alvear@crabcake.cs.jhu.edu
------------------------------
Date: 31 Mar 91 22:59:57 GMT
From:
noao!asuvax!cs.utexas.edu!usc!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!ncar!csn!boulder!tramp.Colorad
o.EDU!millert@arizona.edu (MILLER TODD C)
Subject: Jam Packer (latest version?!?)
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
Does anyone know what the latest version of Jam Packer is and where to get it?
The latest I've seen is 3.0 pre-release version, but it doesn't seem to like
some of my .prgs
thanx,
todd
--
Todd C. Miller | "But all the politiCIAns now
millert@tramp.Colorado.EDU | They have no excuse
al804@cleveland.Freenet.Edu | They just hide behind their power
University of Colorado @ Boulder | And keep us from the truth" - Roger McGuinn
------------------------------
Date: 31 Mar 91 18:16:51 GMT
From: daffy!cat23.cs.wisc.edu!carter@rsch.wisc.edu (Gregory Carter)
Subject: MEGA STE INFO(Hardware Part 2)
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
The Mega STE Revision B motherboard:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
| BACK VELCRO LITHIUM BAT |
| |
| 8530 FDC(UNDERNEATH HDC) |
| POWER SUPPLY |
| BIG SQUARE CHIP??? HARD DISK |
| <-- VME CAGE ENTRANCE--> CONTROLLER |
| VME SUPPORT CHIPS UNIT SELECTOR |
| |
| 68000 MMU?? 4 |
| SIMM |
| ACIA's 68881 MODULES |
| GLUE?? (UNDER HARD DISK)|
| |
| |
| 2 EPROMS/TOS |
| FLOPPY DISK |
|SERIES OF UNKNOWN CHIPS FRONT 8 DIP SWITCH BANK |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well, this is preliminary, but its the best I could do, I have an early
machine, amazingly NO JUMPERS anywhere, the board is very clean. Everything
is pretty much socketed like in most early machines. There were quite a
few chips I didn't understand, I didn't for example see the 68901. It
must have been on the board somewhere, the MB is huge, though!
I thought it was hilarious that I own the only ATARI machine with BUILT
in VELCRO! The 10 Year Lithium battery is held in place by a big piece
of velcro where the scsi would be on the TT.
I didn't think I had a 68881, but I do. WHY, and if it will ever be of
any use, who knows. I think Atari could have saved themselves some money
though by dumping the blitter and math coprocessor. It really is stupid
on a 16MHz M68000.
The FDC is socketed underneath the Hard Disk Controller, and the drive I have
is an EPSON drive, very quite, nice. I couldn't tell if it was an 1.4
meg drive or not, I forgot the serial number. I bet it isn't though.
Lots of conspicuous large SQUARE chips on the board, many I do not know
anything about. I suspect some were VME support chips. Others..WHO KNOWS.
Ripping the machine open is not too hard...amazing, the hard disk is
attached sort of half hazard. It SITS ontop of the SIMMS! You have to
be careful NOT to squish your SIMMS or BREAK them off when you set the DRIVE
BACK IN THE CASE. ONE screw on the bottom of the machine detaches the
hard disk. The ribbon cable is quite long, so that you can pull the
drive out and detach it. You have a double power cable extender that
you must detach from the MB power supply. YOU CANNOT detach the cable
from the drive, we tried no go. Even more bizarre, the top of the case
is GLUED to the hard disk!!! I suppose if you want to add a 60/80
megabyte drive, it will have to be RE-GLUED!!! But it would be possible
to change the drive no el problemo. Interesting, the power supply on
my machine was rated at 70Watts PS case, though my docs say 90W??.
When you pop the top of the case, the floppy drive is attached to the
top of the case via three screws that are mounted through the drive
to 4 posts on the top cover. Very easy to change the drive.
Well, here is some software I wrote, I got the basic information
from joe gaudreau@SUN who was kind enough to give me the information to
make this possible. It switches the MEGA STE into 16Mhz during
bootup so boottime is noticeably shorter.
Here is the program:
table
!"#$%&'()*+,-./0123456789:;<=>?
@ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ[\]~_
begin 644 d:\turbo_c\acics.src\s8to16.tos
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M!' !8 )"0"/+ 1MC/ 1NB!K S1ZP 4T>L '-#\ 0 CR $< @"]"(w
MP#P _"Y D+P !Z@(\ !&\2GD !&Z9P FI"\ ~L \ /PB0"A))&L v
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M3KD *P, ,@2B),3KD &R/P @.0 #L!G!"! 3I @.0 #L1G!"! 3I!.r
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c
end
Enjoy--Gregory
------------------------------
Date: 31 Mar 91 23:59:16 GMT
From: uncle-bens.rice.edu!bgr@rice.edu (Robert G. Rhode)
Subject: MEGA STE INFO(Hardware Part 2)
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
In article <1991Mar31.181651.9813@daffy.cs.wisc.edu>, carter@cat23.cs.wisc.edu
(Gregory Carter) writes:
>
> I didn't think I had a 68881, but I do. WHY, and if it will ever be of
> any use, who knows. I think Atari could have saved themselves some money
> though by dumping the blitter and math coprocessor. It really is stupid
> on a 16MHz M68000.
>
I disagree. The software floating point routines even at 16 MHz could easily
take
5 or 10 times as long as the 68881, and you will find that any computer that is
halfway serious about graphics has a blitter or graphics engine that does
BitBLT.
------------------------------
Date: 31 Mar 91 07:21:48 GMT
From: daffy!cat7.cs.wisc.edu!carter@rsch.wisc.edu (Gregory Carter)
Subject: My MEGA STE
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
I ripped open my MEGA STE and disected it...I will post the goodies I found
in there as soon as I get back...I also wrote this neato program to switch to
16Mhz upon bootup...
I'll Post them sometime soon...
--Gregory
------------------------------
Date: 31 Mar 91 20:27:42 GMT
From:
noao!asuvax!cs.utexas.edu!sdd.hp.com!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!aplcen!jhunix!d_al
vear@arizona.edu (Dom Alvear)
Subject: Need a cooling fan for my 1040ST with ZRAM upgrade
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
>> J. Harris writes about how his ST with ZRAM stops running after a few
>> hours, then when left off for 2-3 hours, boots fine.
>
>I've been having the same problems with my ST. I figured it was heat,
>but I can't seem to find a fan for the thing. I remember a device
>called COM-COOL that sat on top of the Commodore 1541 disk drive, someone
>recommended that I get this as it fit nicely on a 1040. But, I CANT
>FIND ONE ANYWHERE! I need a fan that sits right over the power supply
>on the 1040 (where I could probably fry eggs if I wanted to), but the
>supply also has to have its own power pack, as I don't want to tax the
>power supply any more than I am already.
[stuff deleted...]
>Patrick B. Haggood
>Wayne STate University
>Detroit, MI
>Physics - Class of 1991 (-2?)
This was posted some time ago on comp.sys.atari.st.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Installing a fan on my 1040ST was a sinch. First, I took the sucker apart.
(Warranty??? What warranty??? Oh yeah, do this 91 days after you buy the
machine.) There is a beautiful place to mount the fan between the power
supply and the disk drive right on top of the RF shielding. I just cut a
hole there about 2"x2" and mounted the fan with 4 screws. Since it was
a 12V DC fan, I just connected one wire to the +12V spot on the power supply
and the other to the negative spot. These are labeled on the power supply
so you should have no trouble finding them. Then I put the thing back
together. It fits perfectly. Just go to your local Radio Shack and buy
the fan. I think they have 2 models that will fit in this small space. I
can't remember the part number. It is about 3"x3"x1.5". It is really
quiet too if you put a small resistor inline or a potentiometer to slow the
fan down a bit. Even at full speed, however, the bugger is relatively
quiet compared to a pee cee fan. Bonne chance!
Chris Mauritz
cmm1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hope this helps!
Dom Alvear
d_alvear@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu
alvear@crabcake.cs.jhu.edu
------------------------------
Date: 31 Mar 91 04:37:22 GMT
From:
noao!asuvax!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!swrinde!cs.utexas.edu!sun-barr!newstop!texs
un!convex!rosenkra@arizona.edu (William Rosencranz)
Subject: Standardized GEM look and feel
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
when i wrote the "innocent" statement that there is no real GUI standard
for GEM, i was thinking along the lines of Motif(et al)-like standards
which are widely distributed and for the most part widely accepted and
adopted. sure, all atari GEM application that use windows have the closer
box in the same place, the sliders in the same place, etc. most of them
even function the same. but there is more to a GUI standard than just
how windows look on the screen.
a GUI standard has pros and cons. the major pros are:
o app "looks" and runs the same under many different platforms
(and yes, i understand that GEM applications only really run
on GEM systems: ST and PC)
o (hopefully) applications can be ported easily to other platforms
these are EXTREMEMLY important pros in the big picture. it makes using
applications very easy since learning curve is climbed only once. it makes
writing applications more difficult, but in the long run easier since the
ports are easier.
the cons are:
o restricted from lots of "cute" programming which is non-portable
o speed may be sacrificed
o some things can't be done or are awkward on a specific applicaion
domain (e.g. DTP, music, etc)
to this end, i still don't think there is any real standard. and there is
no well adopted documentation on such a standard i can point to. if there
is, few programmers follow it because it restricts "cute" porgramming
practices (which i have nothing against, BTW, and often, on the ST at least,
the thing which makes a program successful). the desktop is as close
to a standard as we have, IMHO. and it is not that bad, either, though
it is difficult to use if you are a heavy duty programmer (>1000 lines per
week). of course, on the ST you have the distinct advantage of reverting
to a command shell with a single double click on your favorite shell.
and if there IS a widely available document dealing exclusively with
programming practices for GEM, i would sure like to hear about it, whether
it comes from atari or elsewhere. note that i have most every book ever
published (in the US) on the ST, including all those which are out of
print (abacus, sybex, etc etc). i also have the developers docs.
enuf said...
-bill
rosenkra@convex.com
--
Bill Rosenkranz |UUCP:
Convex Computer Corp. |ARPA: rosenkra%c1yankee@convex.com
------------------------------
Date: 31 Mar 91 10:52:27 GMT
From: van-bc!jonh!jhenders@ucbvax.berkeley.edu (John Henders)
Subject: ST Pad specs
To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu
In <1991Mar28.165346.17417@uvm.edu>, Robert B. Pegram writes:
>
>Speaking of CeBIT, what news of TT Sys V R4? I heard it was supposed
>to be introduced there, I know Amiga Sys V R4 is there. I am just a
>little cynical about an Atari Unix introduction any time soon - come
>on guys, make me eat those words! 8-)
I understand there's some screen-shots of the TT running Atari
Unix up on GEnie. A friend of mine said it was shipping, and requires
8 meg and 100+ meg of hard drive ( what, no floppy version? ;-
The TTx has not been announced yet. Please note, this information
is from Canada, and so may not accurately reflect conditions in the U.S.
--
John Henders jhenders@jonh.wimsey.bc.ca
MIND over MIDI Productions or ubc.cs!van-bc!jonh!jhenders
Vancouver,B.C
------------------------------
End of Info-Atari16 Digest
******************************
