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Info-Atari16 Digest Vol. 89 Issue 492
INFO-ATARI16 Digest Sun, 29 Apr 90 Volume 90 : Issue 492
Today's Topics:
Bob Brodie in Rochester (mini-review), and TT talk
Lharc 113 problems ....
My opinion of the comp.sys.atari.st.tech proposal
Quick ST demo problem
Version 1.01 of click.prg available
Virus questions (2 msgs)
what is this Z doing here!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: 30 Apr 90 01:41:58 GMT
From: sunybcs!fredonia!sale5312@rutgers.edu (Marty Saletta)
Subject: Bob Brodie in Rochester (mini-review), and TT talk
Message-ID: <1837@fredonia.UUCP>
Yesterday (4/28) I was able to attend the talk Bob Brodie gave at the
Rochester Institute of Technology. I went with 8 members of my local ST
user group, The Buffalo Region Atari Group (BRAG-ST). In total, I would
estimate the total number of people who attended the talk would be about
80 at the Webb Auditorium at RIT.
Mr. Brodie brought along with him a 4 MB 4160(?)STe, a 4MB Stacy, a Lynx,
a Megafile 60 HD, and a 44 MB removable HD system. He spoke about each unit,
which lasted about 40 minutes, then took Q&A for about 1-1/2 to 2 hours(!).
Maybe longer, I lost count...:~) Mr. Brodie mentioned that all the products
he was showing were *not* vaporware, and were shipping..."somewhere"... For
your Lynx fans, he mentioned that he hoped that there would be over 20 games
for the Lynx by X-mas. (The STe is shipping, but I believe Atari is having
doubts about shipping the 4 MB version.)
Mr. Brodie showed the Lynx commercial that was test-run in NYC and other
places. I see it quite often living near Canada on the CBC.
Mr. Brodie also mentioned that Atari feels that the 130XE is no longer
a "power without the price" computer, and will phase-out the 8-bits. I am
sad to hear this (I started out with a 400 many moons ago), but at the same
time it is understandable. A 130XE + disk drive is just about the price
of a 520STFM. He said that the last 130XE has been produced (a 50,000 run?)
but they'll be used in house for the exchange policy. Argue if you want,
but the 8-bit era is over in the 90's. :~(
After the Q&A finished, there was a raffle of the 80-col card and the word
processor built for it (8 bit), 5 or 6 TOS 1.4 upgrades (both 6 and 2 chip
sets) and also the Megafile 60 HD he used for the demo. (Although I didn't
win anything, other members in my BRAG group won the Megafile 60 and three
TOS 1.4's...hey- gotta BRAG, right? :~) Oh yes, tickets were only $1 ea. for
the raffle, and I guess the show was free. Also the *new* Lynx cart, Gauntlet,
was a prize in the raffle.
The show concluded with an auction of Atari products of a store that
phased-out their Atari line. Several titles went under $4. VIP Professional,
still in the cellophane wrapping, went for $10. I picked up Infocom's
"Deadline" (ST), a Chinese cooking database (ST, for my girlfriend; I'm a
vegetarian...:~), a Logo book (was bundled with the cooking program),
and the 130XE and DOS 2.5 manuals (XE) all for under $6 total. After the
auction the group left the Auditorium and went to a pizza party with Mr.
Brodie, with tickets costing $4. BRAG did not stick around for the
pizza.
After seeing the show I left disappointed. Not at all with Mr. Brodie;
I was very impressed with him. I've been to several shows along these lines
(Atari, Apple, NeXT, etc.) and Mr. Brodie is one of the best speakers
(and perhaps more importantly, *listeners*) I've seen. He is a real credit
to the Atari family, and I hope he sticks around for a while (lifetime
contract would be ok...:~) I think Atari can sleep at night knowing that
Mr. Brodie is one of the people contacting us peons who use or want to
Atari computers. If any Atari junkie has the chance to see him talk,
I recommend it.
So why was I disappointed? Maybe because I am sick of the "game machine"
image Atari has. My girlfriend who also attended teases me about how my
ST is a game machine (friendly, but others aren't that nice.) Although
I am very happy with my ST (I couldn't have survived college without
1st Word, Thunder, Uniterm, etc.), I would like a faster unit and Unix.
Faster unit and Unix. Ah ha! The TT! Let me state that if Atari
introduced the TT (Unix, 68030, runs ST software too) for under $3000
a year ago I would have been first line for one (well, maybe not
first, at least until I could have raised the money.) Now I'm not so
sure about getting one ASAP, if at all. The great majority of
questions was about the Lynx, local dealer problems, etc. There
was one or two about the TT, but nothing much was said. Of course,
this is because it is not being manufactured now which is understandable,
but there seemed to be zero interest in the machine. One of the reasons
I went to the show was to find info on it, but all I got was that the
TT passed FCC tests and software was being worked on now. Mr. Brodie did
not give a release date (i.e. "very soon", "September", etc.) which I
think is a good thing. Instead of the "very soon now" or "
Quarter of next year", saying nothing about a release date will not make
him (or Atari) look bad should the machine fail to appear (nah...that wouldn't
happen, would it? :~)
If the TT appears late this year or early 1991, I will not buy one for
at least two years. Why? First, I bought my ST in October of 1985, and I
thought that this would be the machine that would defeat the Mac (or at least
come very close to it.) I didn't think that even Atari could mess it up.
But what happened? Instead of getting the (then) under-$1,000 512K 68000
based machine (i.e. power) into colleges and business applications, it's
sold through Toys R Us. Toys R Us? Think of Toys R Us. What do you
think of? I think of 3-to-5-year-olds running up and down the store. If I
don't want to buy a computer there, would upper-level executives? Or people
in charge of universities? And what about support?
I thought that Atari, having a reputation problem then, would give away
ST's (or at least make a *huge* discount) to universities to follow
Apple's lead. That would at least get them "in the door". And I don't
think many places would turn down a free Atari computer because at
least they would have been able to play games if nothing else. :~) Let's
hope Atari doesn't make the same mistake with the TT.
So, to get back to the meeting: with three user groups represented,
I should be able to assume that there was a deceint sample of Atari users.
And if nobody had enough interest to press about the TT (at least get a few
more "no comment at this time"'s from Mr. Brodie, should I, an Atari ST
user, be worried? That is one thing I haven't figured out yet.
Who is Atari going to aim the TT at? (Let me assume that the TT
will be 68030-based, run some flavor of Unix, and be ST upward-compatable.)
Will Atari try to sell the TT to the current ST userbase as an upgrade?
I hope not, at least as a major source of sales. Sure, there are some
of us who would love getting a much faster ST *and* Unix, but the
majority (at least a good number) I'd guess of current ST users don't really
want Unix. (This will be debated here since about >90% of you reading this
via Usenet are probably using Unix right now, either rn, readnews, etc.)
I got to see for the first time a bunch of ST users (ok, just 70), but they
didn't seem to know what a Unix is or if you have to feed it and burp it.
That's fine, but why should Atari try to sell them a TT? I think they
shouldn't. You can have a zillion computers sold, but how many will push
Unix to the limit? How many will even use the Unix end of the machine?
Ok, then who should Atari sell the TT to? How about schools? If they
could offer a big-fat discount to high schools and colleges for a machine
that runs both Unix and the pre-existing ST software line and bundle
a bunch of PD and/or commercial ST software that shines on it, I think
Atari would advance to the next plateau from "game company" to whatever
in many eyes (important ones at that.)
I would love to hear in about a year or so, people from the educational
and business world saying "Atari finally made a *real* computer this time!",
and us past and present ST owners (and 8-bitters for that matter) would
just smile and say welcome to the world of Atari...
Last week I attended a NeXT demo at my school, and I really liked the
machine. The problem I have is that at over $10,000, I don't see myself
getting one (unless I win the lottery or something, but since I don't
play I don't see myself winning...:~) It's a really fine computer that's
worth the >$10K, but for the low-to-medium user like me? It's just not
practical for what I'd use it for at home (little word processing, and
Really-Not-Professional C programs...at least not the commercial type...)
I suspect that there are a few others out there who would like to
have a Unix computer, but can't afford the current crop. If the TT could
fill this void (be under $3000) Atari's got a hit on their hands, *if*
they sell it as a Unix computer first, ST compatable second. "Runs
Unix and has a library of programs that can already be run on it too!"
would be a nice pitch for the TT. I just can't see Atari hoping to sell
the TT *only* to the current ST user base.
To conclude (finally...), I hope no one takes the above as
Atari-bashing, which has in the past been fashionable in these
newsgroups. I've used an Atari computer since 1983, going through
a 400,600XL,130XE, and finally a 520ST w/1 MB. I've sold everything
except the 600XL (still 16K, no drive) and the ST. I am hoping I
will not have to leave the Atari world. I'm really hoping Atari
breaks into the "serious" market with the TT. Should they start to
sell the TT to a more serious user market (not through Toys R Us),
I'll be in line to get one. If I can play Kreskin for a moment,
in five years time, I think I'll be working on a newer computer with a
little Fuji symbol on it...:~)
--
Marty Saletta The above has been in a mayonnaise jar on
Fredonia State University Funk and Wagnalls' porch since noon today...
fredonia!sale5312@cs.buffalo.edu Yankees: 7th place, -4 games
...
------------------------------
Date: 30 Apr 90 00:11:29 GMT
From: usc!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!van-bc!johna@ucsd.edu (John Altstadt)
Subject: Lharc 113 problems ....
Message-ID: <359@van-bc.UUCP>
In article <sent.Fri.Apr.27.20:26:59.GMT.1990.via.CS.TARDIS>
olorin@tardis.computer-science.edinburgh.ac.uk writes:
>
> Is there a version of lharc later than 113 for the ST ? 113 has one
>or two problems. Basically it will not read unix lharc files. This is rather
>a nuisance as it appears that the source code was archived with unix lharc
>and it thus wont extract its own source !
At last! Someone else has noticed this. I posted something to this
effect two weeks ago and received exactly one response from someone who
claimed that unlzh1[246].prg would pull it apart. Well version 1.2 and
1.4 had exactly the same result... 4 or 5 copies of files with strange
names overwriting each other. I don't have unlzh16.prg to test against
the lharc113 lhz archive.
If anybody did get the archive unpacked, or if there is a newer version,
PLEASE send me (and olorin@tardis) email. If I can just once get my hands
on the source code, I can patch it so that it will accept \ AND / as
directory separators.
--
John Altstadt, 6135 Carson St., Burnaby, B.C., CANADA, V5J 2Z8
NET: ..!ubc-cs!van-bc!johna || ..!uunet!van-bc!johna || johna@wimsey.bc.ca
CIS: 76066,1015 || 76066.1015@compuserve.com (via INTERNET)
------------------------------
Date: 27 Apr 90 17:40:35 GMT
From: hpfcso!hpldola!jg@hplabs.hp.com (Joe Gilray)
Subject: My opinion of the comp.sys.atari.st.tech proposal
Message-ID: <11830077@hpldola.HP.COM>
My vote is NOT to start comp.sys.atari.tech as I don't see any advantage
to the split
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 29 Apr 90 18:46:25 EDT
From: clark@mshri.utoronto.ca
Subject: Quick ST demo problem
Message-ID: <9004292246.AA00171@lash.utcs.utoronto.ca>
/> I have the demo version of Quick ST 1.8 and am having problems with
/[brikabrak deleted]
/>At the recent Toronto Atrai Confederation show I spoke to someone at the
/>Branch Always booth (the people who make Quick ST) describing this problem
/>that I had had with an earlier version of their then shareware demo. He
/>assured me that the problem of dropping decoy cursors had been fixed. It
/>just makes me wonder...
/
/
/if you really listened to us at the show, you would have heard us repeatedly
/tell customers that the current demo version is 2.0, NOT 1.8. The cursor
/problem is fixed in 2.0 (or at least no one has reported a cursor bug
/problem for the last couple of months).
/
/keep wondering ...
/
/
/--
/=====Ignac A. Kolenko (The Ig)=====watmath!watcgl!electro!brasoft!ignac======
/ co-author of QuickST, and the entire line of Quick Software!!!!
/ Branch Always Software Box 2624, Station B, Kitchener, Ont. CANADA N2H 6N2
/=============================================================================
I guess I was at some of the other booths when you were making your
repeated announcements, and there was nothing in the docs of v1.8 to
indicate its date of release. Nevertheless, I'm glad to hear from the
horse's mouth that the cursor problem is solved. How about uploading it to
the TAF bulletin board and sharing it with us people in Toronto? The latest
version they have is 1.6.
Steve Clark
clark@mshri.utoronto.ca (Internet)
sinai@utoroci (Netnorth/Bitnet)
"Nothing in biology makes sense except in the context of evolution."
------------------------------
Date: 30 Apr 90 00:32:42 GMT
From: haven!wam!dmb@purdue.edu (David M. Baggett)
Subject: Version 1.01 of click.prg available
Message-ID: <1990Apr30.003242.2207@wam.umd.edu>
Thanks to Samuel Streeper for pointing out a bug in Digital Keyclick.
I've updated terminator:atari/music/samples/digistuf.arc to include
version 1.01 of click.prg. (terminator = 35.1.33.8)
The problem was with a conflict between Digital Keyclick and the
standard ST system beep. Digital Keyclick was not cleaning up
the sound chip properly, which resulted in an annoying high pitched
whine. Yow. Since I never have the standard ST system beep on,
I didn't notice. Oops.
If you've got 1.0, save your hearing and upgrade to 1.01.
Dave Baggett
dmb@cscwam.umd.edu
------------------------------
Date: 29 Apr 90 22:10:58 GMT
From: unccvax!cs01bd@mcnc.org (brian daniels)
Subject: Virus questions
Message-ID: <1993@unccvax.UUCP>
Does anyone out there know if viruses that attach themselves to files
exist on the st? The anti-virus programs I have seen are all concerned
with the boot sector only. Does this mean that I can safely copy the files
one-by-one off of a disk that is suspected to be infected and onto another disk
without risking cross-contamination?
Thanks in advance,
Brian Daniels
(Cs01bd@unccvax)
------------------------------
Date: 30 Apr 90 00:01:04 GMT
From: larserio@ifi.uio.no (LarsErikOsterud)
Subject: Virus questions
Message-ID: <CMM.0.88.641433664.larserio@gille.uio.no>
Yes, there are link-viruses on the ST
Over here in Europe there are several.
The AVK or VDU virus killer checks for link-viruses too...
They can destory/conteminate ALL the files on a hard-disk in a few secs !!
Nasty things !!!!
Lars-Erik / ABK-BBS +47 2132659 / ____ ______ ________________________
Osterud / larserio@ifi.uio.no / /___ / The norwegian ST
__________/ ______________________/ ____/ / Klubben, user association
------------------------------
Date: 29 Apr 90 21:17:56 GMT
From:
sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!brutus.cs.uiuc.edu!ux1.cso.uiuc.edu!cs325e
c@ucsd.edu (Gregory Lemperle-Kerr)
Subject: what is this Z doing here!
Message-ID: <1990Apr29.211756.1415@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu>
type 'uncompress filename.Z'
-- Greg
------------------------------
End of INFO-ATARI16 Digest V90 Issue #492
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