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Demo News 076
Start.of.DemoNews.076=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
______/\___________________________
DemoNews Issue #76 \____ \ ________ _ _ ______ \
December 25, 1994 -- December 31, 1994 / | \ _) \ \_/ \ | \
/ | \ \ | \ | \
DemoNews is a weekly publication for \_____ /_______/___| /________/
the demo scene. It is produced at the ===\_____/============|____/==========
Internet FTP site ftp.eng.ufl.edu __ ________________ ___ /\_______
(aka HORNET). This newsletter focuses / \| \ ________ | \/ ______/
on many aspects of demos and demo- / \ \ _) \ | \______ \
making. Everyone is welcomed to / \ \ /~\ \ / \
contribute articles, rumors, and \____\_____/_______/_________/________/
advertisements. ==============================[+tZ^]===
<< Christopher G. Mann [Snowman/HORNET] - r3cgm@dax.cc.uakron.edu >>
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SIZE: 91,633 SUBSCRIBERS: Last week: 1020 This week: 1075 Change: +55
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Section 1.......Standard Information --> Who Are We?
Section 2....................General --> General Comments by Snowman
Interview with EMF
DemoNews Readers Write
Kimba's Life Story
Section 3..................Editorial --> X-Mas in the Demo Scene
Section 4......DemoNews Advancements --> CORE, Demo & Music Database
DemoNews Readers Write
Section 5..................Partyline --> The Party 1994
Section 6................New Uploads --> New Files for the Week
Section 7...........Musicians Corner --> Interview with Purple Motion/FC
Interview with Krystall / Astek
Common Sence ][ by PeriSoft
Section 8..............Coders Corner --> Its X-Mas in Africa
Interview with Maxwood/Majic 12
Assembly Part ][ by Jason Nunn
Section 9.............Artists Corner --> Common Sence Response by Stony
Section 10.............Advertisements --> Triplex BBS
Data Connection BBS
Section 11................Back Issues --> How to get 'em
Section 12...........Closing Comments --> Quote for the Week
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(Section 1) .oOOOo. o o
o o O O
O. O o o
`OOoo. oOo o o
`O o .oOoO' 'OoOo. .oOoO .oOoO' `OoOo. .oOoO
o O O o o O o O O o o o O
O. .O o o O O o O o o O O O o
`oooO' `oO `OoO'o o O `OoO'o `OoO'o o `OoO'o
ooOoOOo .oOo
O O o
o o O
O OoO oOo
o 'OoOo. o .oOo. `OoOo. `oOOoOO. .oOoO' o O .oOo. 'OoOo.
O o O O O o o O o o O o O o O o o O
O O o o o O O o O O o O o O o O O o
ooOOoOo o O O' `OoO' o O o o `OoO'o `oO o' `OoO' o O
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The name "HORNET" refers to several things. First, it is the name of a
demo FTP site on Internet (hornet.eng.ufl.edu). Second, it is a group of
people who help to manage files, write articles for DemoNews, and contribute
various other things. In this respect, HORNET could also be considered a
demo group in the literal sense.
"DemoNews" is a weekly newsletter containing information on various
aspects of the demo scene, including but not limited to: coding, music,
graphics, and design. We have a regular staff that puts this newsletter
together, but everyone is encouraged to contribute articles.
Site Name : HORNET
Address : hornet.eng.ufl.edu (128.227.116.7)
Location : Florida, USA
System E-Mail : dmw@eng.ufl.edu or
r3cgm@dax.cc.uakron.edu
<There are currently 10 active demo-operators for this site>
/ Christopher G. Mann -- COORDINATOR -- r3cgm@dax.cc.uakron.edu \
|Jeff (White Noise) WEBMASTER | MUSICOP Ryan Cramer|
|Kim Davies DNDISTRO | CODEOP Grant Smith (Denthor)|
|Mike DREVIEW | CARTICLE Dee-Cug (Jason Nunn)|
|Brenton Swart (Zenith) DREVIEW | CREVIEW David Thornley (Metal)|
|Burning Chrome DEMOBOOK | ARTOP Stony|
\ /
<There are currently 7 other FTP sites that mirror HORNET>
/ \
|FTP Name IP Address Country Base Directory |
|-------------------- -------------- --------- --------------------|
|ftp.uwp.edu 131.210.1.4 USA /pub/msdos/demos |
|*ftp.luth.se 130.240.18.2 SWEDEN /pub/msdos/demos |
|ftp.sun.ac.za 146.232.212.21 S. AFRICA /pub/msdos/demos |
|ftp.uni-erlangen.de 131.188.2.43 GERMANY /pub/pc/msdos/demos |
|ftp.uni-paderborn.de 131.234.10.42 GERMANY /pub/msdos/pc-demos |
|*ftp.cdrom.com 192.216.191.11 USA /pub/demos |
|freedom.wit.com 144.92.88.30 USA /systems/ibmpc/demos|
\ /
*Site mirrors the /incoming directory
[SUBSCRIBING TO DEMONEWS]
You can subscribe to this newsletter by mailing listserver@oliver.sun.ac.za
and putting "subscribe demuan-list your_real_name" in your message.
The listserver sends out this newsletter every SUNDAY morning. Kim Davies
is the keeper of the listserver. If you have any questions about
subscribing to DemoNews, you can reach him at kimba@it.com.au
For those who use the GUI environment check out our DN.HMTL in the
/demos/news directory. The URL is ftp://ftp.eng.ufl.edu/demos/news/DN.HTML
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.oOOOo. o
.O o O
o o
O O
O .oOOo .oOo. 'OoOo. .oOo. `OoOo. .oOoO' o
o. O OooO' o O OooO' o O o O
O. oO O O o O O o O o
(Section 2) `OooO' `OoO' o O `OoO' o `OoO'o Oo
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(General Comments by Snowman)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-It appears as though Kim Davies is not going to be our "listserver dude"
anymore. I was contacted and believe that this responsibility is being
passed on to me.
-There are lots of great articles in here this week. Sorry I didn't have
more time to move the files.
-I will be gone for a lot of the time in the next couple weeks. I might
have a bit of difficulty answering mail quickly, so be understanding if
you are waiting for a reply.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
(Interview with Saracen, Saint, and TGR of EMF by Snowman)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
EMF (ElectroMotive Force) is one of the biggest names in the demo scene.
At the recent demo party "Assembly 94" they took first in the demo
competition with their demo "Verses". The #1 spot has traditionally been
held only by Future Crew, and EMF's victory has done a lot to increase
their standing in the demo world.
Three of the coders for EMF (Saracen, Saint, and TGR) agreed to meet with
the DemoNews crew for an interview. Their shared experience and wisdom
are remarkable, and it definitely shows in all of their works.
This was a rather odd interview. All four of us met on IRC (Internet Relay
Chat), and the connection was very poor. There was a tremendous lag and
often times I would get answers to questions I had asked several minutes
ago. In addition, there were three people being interviewed, not one. At
first I thought this would be more difficult, but as it turned out, all
three seemed to know what to say and when to say it. There were very few
identical comments from different EMF members.
<S> = Christopher G. Mann - [Snowman/HORNET] - r3cgm@dax.cc.uakron.edu
SAR = Teemu Valtonen - [Saracen/EMF] - src@ap.utu.fi
SNT = Jani Mattsson - [Saint/EMF] - jpm@mits.mdata.fi
TGR = Jani Lehmuskoski - [TGR/EMF] - jalehmus@freenet.hut.fi
Note: General mail to EMF can be directed to emf@mea.utu.fi
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
[start of interview: December 21, 1994, 21:51GMT]
<S>: How old are each of you? What are your occupations (student, etc)
and where do you live?
SAR: I'm 19. I study Computer Science at the University of Turku and I
live in Turku, Finland.
SNT: 18, high school (IB=International Baccalaureate, last year), in
Turku, Finland.
TGR: 18 years, high school, Turku Finland.
<S>: How long has EMF existed and where did it get its start?
SAR: EMF was founded in January, 1991 by the ex-members of a group
called Gremlins. Oh wait, I could add that the only remaining
founder members are Devastator and Druid.
<S>: Was Gremlins on the Amiga or another platform?
SAR: Gremlins was an early PC group.. In 1990 they released an intro,
"Whee!" which was one of the first (maybe the first!) PC scene
productions with 256 colors :)
<S>: How did you all meet, and how was the name "EMF" chosen?
SAR: The founder members studied in the same high school so they
knew each other quite well.
SNT: Devastator told he picked the name from a dictionary, which
just explained the abbreviation EMF to mean Electromotive Force,
and thought it was cool.. :)
<S>: How did the rest of you come to be in EMF then?
SAR: I knew some of the members and was looking for a new group before
Assembly'92 and EMF needed some routines for their Assembly'92 demo so
I somehow got in :)
TGR: In year 1993 group called Altair joined EMF. We all knew each other
from the WHQ of EMF, called Genius BBS. Altair's members were Saint,
Daemon and Vortex, and myself.
SAR: We knew Whalebone through a friend and this year, after the announcement
we made in the info file of Verses, some guys contacted us. We found
out that they are cool and so they became members...
<S>: How did Edge end up joining EMF?
SNT: We were in need for musicians and graphicians, and we announced it in
the infofile that came with Verses. Before we were almost all coders,
Saracen was doing some graphics and we had problems giving Whalebone
the initiative to make some music' ;)
SAR: We were looking for musicians and graphicians and had the announcement
in the info file of Verses... Edge and Prism were looking for a group
(they thought their previous group was a bit too unproductive) and Edge
knew Devastator so they decided to try their luck... and they were
accepted. Oh, did you know that NiK/ex-Sonic PC also joined us
recently?
<S>: I do now. :) What other groups does EMF have ties with?
SNT: Well, our new musicians, especially Edge has close connections with
the members of FC and former Sonic PC, we others perhaps not such tight
ties.. :)
SAR: We also have some connections to the Amiga scene. Virtual Dreams is
one example.
<S>: I'd like to talk a bit about your demos. First, how do you decide who
does what, and how is communication handled in the group?
SNT: About who does what... First, each of us has some ideas of our own
and develops them and codes the final routine.
Then there are such things as the sound system and the front end system,
which are planned more or less together. Usually someone ends up to be
responsible for some part. For example, Saracen is responsible for the
SB driver and I'm currently responsible for our S3M driver...
SAR: ...but in practice everyone can do whatever he wants...
TGR: ...more or less. We hold meetings once in a while and gather our
ideas...
SAR: ...and we communicate through internet, our WHQ BBS, and of course
phone.
<S>: Who is usually responsible for putting everything together and finishing
it up?
SAR: Usually Devastator and I are responsible of putting things together but
everyone participates in finishing the production.
<S>: I have to ask. Why did you decide to do a duck and a teacup in the
geurard section at the end of Verses?
SNT: We didn't have any other objects. :-) And they looked nice.. you know,
there's a hidden symbology behind the objects, but it is left for the
viewer to find it out. :)
SAR: Actually, it's quite hard to choose objects for a goraud spacecut so
that the routine would look "realistic". :)
<S>: Concerning Assembly 94 [where Verses placed 1st in the demo competition],
what thoughts do you have on its organization?
SAR: In general the organizing seemed to be quite ok, but due to some mistakes
some individuals made the party has gotten a bad name... We can't
expect a party to be perfect when the organizers are only human beings
and not professional.
Actually we haven't received all the prices from the ASM94 organization
yet, but we've been told that this is only Gore's fault and the rest of
the organizers can't do anything about it.
<S>: Do you think that the results for ASM94 were accurate?
SAR: I think the results are accurate in a sense that the votes were counted
correctly, but I must disagree with the audience in some cases... For
example in the demo competition some demos were IMHO [In my humble
opinion] ranked too high... (no names, though)
<S>: Do you have anything planned for The Party 1994?
SNT: Well, we talked about making an intro earlier in the autumn, but then
we decided not to make any, since we don't currently have very much time
(school, studying, internet, etc.:)). But we'll probably release a new
version of Verses soon that supports SB and also a music disk featuring
modules from our new musicians, Edge and Prism.
SAR: I'd like to add that we don't want to release another hastily made
production...
<S>: Do you mean that Verses was put together in a hurry?
SAR: Yes... we weren't satisfied with the result but didn't want to make any
major changes in the release version because we think that doing so is
somewhat unfair.
<S>: What advise do you have for starting demo groups out there?
SAR: Advice? Well... one has to learn the basics - that's relatively easy
with all the code tutorials etc. people are making nowadays. Then
it's just a question of innovation.
SNT: Hmmm.. for starting coders, try to find the idea behind effects and
think how to code it and practice coding something, usually only reading
somebody's sources won't be very effective method to learn. Understanding
the way something works and trying to implement those ideas will help
learning.
<S>: What manuals should beginning coders get to learn how to program?
SAR: I dunno - I have only one coding-related book which I bought when I
already had learned to code. :) Learning the very basics of ASM can
be achieved by reading others' sources, and in addition to that a
beginner needs a couple of good documents such as HelpPC and PCGPE.
SNT: Well, the PC Game Programmers' Encyclopedia seems to contain a
variety of good documents on different kinds of effects also for the
demo code..
<S>: What do you think of the American demo scene?
TGR: Do you mean Tran? :)
<S>: Other than Tran....
SAR: The Americans do have potential, but I haven't heard of any decent
groups but Renaissance this far and it seems that they're not much
into demos nowadays. I hope that the situation will change in the
future.
There seems to be a growing music scene in the States, but the American
groups lack good coders and graphicians. This must be because the
American scene is so young...
<S>: Are there other things you'd like to say before we are done?
SNT: Keep up with the good work with DemoNews and Hornet! ;)
<S>: Well, good night everyone. Thanks for coming.
[end of interview: December 21, 1994, 23:15GMT]
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
(Kimba's Life Story)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Snowman has asked me, as I am sure he has asked a few other people, to
write an article for this weeks Demonews. I don't really have anything to
say so I will baffle on for a few paragraphs like the others do ;-)
Here's my life story...
I am the listowner for this mailing list (as well as those for Inertia
Player, and KLF) which means I handle moderating/[un]subscribing/etc
matters involved. Whenever mail bounces or something I am the lucky person
who sorts through it all to make sense of it and try to fix it. The
traffic this generates for me is quite large, and requires quite a bit of
time sitting in elm drinking Coke each week. It also means I am yelled at
by Snowman should Demonews be out a little too late :-) (Like a few weeks
ago..)
Back to Demos.. Well, I am a coder for Oxygen (A pretty popular demo group
in my home state of Western Australia) and KLF (A pretty popular music
group everywhere :) - as of late I haven't done much for them - been pretty
busy with exams, 3 jobs, and perthnet/internet.
Oh well, I'll see you around, probably in news as it is about the only
thing that doesn't cost me money... I suppose I have to greet some people
- Chuck Biscuits, Force Format, Black Artist - who are some Australian guys
who are actually doing something...
Merry Xmas,
Kim Davies [kimba@it.com.au, kim@omen.com.au]
Statix/Oxygen^KLF
Perthnet
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o.OOoOoo o o
O O o o O
o o O o
ooOO o oOo O
O .oOoO O o .oOo. `OoOo. O .oOoO' o
o o O o O O o o o O o O
O O o O o o O O O o O o
(Section 3) ooOooOoO `OoO'o o' `oO `OoO' o o' `OoO'o Oo
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
(X-Mas in the Demo Scene)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Its Christmas time, and all of the coders, musicians, artists, and
organizers are spending time with their loved ones. I am no exception,
as I'm currently writing this editorial from my mother's house, far away
from my apartment in Akron.
This holiday season, I'd like to think of the demo scene as my family of
sorts. After all, I spend more time on IRC and answering e-mail than I do
with my very own relatives. 8) In a very real sence, the demo scene is
a family not connected through blood, but through BBS's, FTP's, IRC,
e-mail, music, graphics, code, and of course, demos.
Some of you lucky people out there will be going to The Party 1994 this
next week. What could be a better way of spending time over the holidays!?
When New Year's Eve rolls around, I'll probably be back in my apartment,
watching all of the great contributions to this party in Denmark. Until
then, I will content myself to take a small vacation from HORNET and Demo-
News while I visit my family.
This year I'll be getting a brand new double speed Sony CD-ROM drive. This
is a far cry from the Legos or Transformers I would have cheered about in
years past. This reminds me of how things evolve over the years, and how
the demo scene has changed my life. This is why I have taken so much time
with this issue of DemoNews: its my gift to all you demo enthusiasts out
there this X-mas.
I hope you all have a wonderful time over the holidays. If you get a
chance, drop me some e-mail and tell me how it went.
-Christopher G. Mann (Snowman) / HORNET December 25, 1994
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o.OOOo. o. O
O `o Oo o
o O O O O
O o O o o
o O .oOo. `oOOoOO. .oOo. O o O .oOo. 'o O .oOo
O o OooO' O o o O o o O O OooO' O o o `Ooo.
o .O' O o O O o O o Oo O o O O O
OooOO' `OoO' O o o `OoO' O `o `OoO' `Oo'oO' `OoO'
Oo o
o O O
O o o
oOooOoOo o
o O .oOoO `o O .oOoO' 'OoOo. .oOo .oOo.
O o o O O o O o o O O OooO'
o O O o o O o O O o o O
(Section 4) O. O `OoO'o `o' `OoO'o o O `OoO' `OoO'
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(CORE, Demo & Music Database by Burning Chrome)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What is CORE?
-------------
CORE is a newly developed product of the HORNET demosite team. It will be
the most comprehensive demo-related contact database ever to be created.
CORE is currently in its development stages, and should make its "official"
debut sometime towards the end of January 1995. This is to allow for the
completion of the SQL compliant database structures and to permit ample
time for all the groups that wish to have up-to-date info in CORE to send
in an updated form. The final product will allow for cross-referenced
searches, printing of single or multiples records and definable lists, and
actual VGA logos of the groups. This will be a very time consuming effort,
and only you, the actual demoscene members, can help to make this database
a reality.
Every entry in CORE will include the following items:
1) Group's Name
2) Group's Logo
3) Member Listing
4) Internet Email Address
5) Snail Mail Address
6) Primary BBS Support System (WHQ)
7) Listing of ALL Support Sites for the Group
8) Comprehensive Listing of the Group's Releases
9) A Brief History of the Group
We are not limiting CORE to the above outline though, as just as time
changes, so will the database.
We have not yet decided on the size of the Group Logo, although it is known
that the resolution will be 640x480x16. We will probably go with a
thumbnail style of logo (around 96x72 or 128x96).
The database is currently being produced for the DOS environment, although
work has already been initiated for Windows and OS/2 versions.
Message from Burning Chrome
---------------------------
I hope all of you are looking forward to the official release of CORE. In
early December, I released a "preliminary" release that was not yet in its
SQL-compliant form, nor loaded with all the "great" features. This was in
hopes that the members of the demoscene would promptly complete the form
and return it to me. So far, I have only received about 5 completed forms.
Please spread the word about this project, so that I can help make all of
your lives easier when you want to contact someone in the scene.
CORE will be a monthly release. It will constantly be going through
changes until we have prefected its interface and ease of use, not to
mention the fact that the demoscene changes everyday. I will certainly be
in need of any and all assistance that anyone has to offer. Please contact
me and tell me how you can help!
Submitting an Entry for CORE
----------------------------
If you would like to have your demo or music group added to this database,
please fill out the attached form.
Please provide all of the information requested below. If any of the
fields cannot be answered, please place a "N/A" in that field. After you
have completed this form, please forward it to Burning Chrome. He can be
reached by any of the following ways:
1) Internet: bchrome@foley.ripco.com
2) BBS: Piracetam (1-813-996-3902)
3) DGiNet: 68:500/0
4) GSNNet: 864:1/1 (Currently Not Available Due to Inability to Connect
to Host System - Crashmail is possible though)
5) FIDONet: 1:377/75
6) SBCNet: 13:204/1
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
The CORE Form:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Group Name:
Type of Group (Demo, Music, Both):
Internet Contact Address:
Snail Mail Address:
Total Number of Members:
Listing of All Members:
Listing of Productions to Date (Include the filename, a short description
of each filename, and the date of release for each filename):
Primary BBS Name, SysOp Name, and Number (Your WHQ):
Listing of All HQ & Dist. Sites for your group (Please provide the BBS
name, it's status (?HQ or dist, etc.), the sysop's name, and the phone
number):
Any other information that we might need:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Burning Chrome
bchrome@foley.ripco.com
S: Piracetam (813-996-3902)
--
~~~ Burning Chrome
SysOp: Piracetam (813)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
(DemoNews Readers Write)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[Below is a quote of a message I sent to a few people recently. In an
effort to stay in touch with the readers of DemoNews, I thought it might
be nice to include a couple of their responses.]
> My name is Christopher G. Mann, and I am currently in charge of
> producing and distributing DemoNews. I noticed that your address
> indicated you are currently working for the government.
>
> In an effort to find out more about the recipients of DemoNews
> (and there is quite a large spectrum of people) I was wondering
> if you could tell me how it is that a government employee came
> to take an interest in the demo scene.
[Response 1/2]
Christopher:
Not _all_ government employees are mindless bureaucrats - some of us
actually have lives outside of our workaday life <grin>.
My interest in DemoNews started when I was searching on the Internet
for game development utilities and code. My roommate is a professional
software developer, and business for him has been pretty shaky for the
past six months. He has been toying with the idea of writing some simple
shareware games, and I offered to help (I'm much more of an amateur
programmer, but I'm hoping to learn by doing). After searching around a
bit I came across a reference to the demo site. [HORNET]
I wish I could say that I've written some really neat demos, but I haven't
(hey - maybe I _am_ a mindless bureaucrat!). Keep up the excellent work,
and perhaps one of these days my roommate or myself will come through with
something spiffy to contribute.
Yours truly,
James Long, GIS Technician
Department of Fish and Game
[Response 2/2]
Christopher,
What's the question? Oh yes how did a government worker take to the demo
scene. Well I guess I'll give you long version. I started getting into
computers when I got my Atari 800XL, I was in Jr. High. I wrote my first
lengthy program then also. It incorporated graphics, sounds, and music.
Although the music was bloops and bleeps (but it gave you four bloops and
bleeps at once). Since then I traveled through high school and the year I
started college, I picked up a job with the United States Geological
Survey and a 286 compatible. At work I mainly help in the process of
making topographical maps of Earth and Mars. (So you see I'm really a
closet music lover at work).
A couple years later some friends and I started a alternative rock band.
So I picked up a keyboard and a SB original. I wanted to do more computer
related music so two of us split up the original band and started our own.
I got rid of the SB and picked up a Proaudio spectrum. It was then my
eyes were opened to MODs. I could not believe the stuff I was hearing.
(I was a virgin to this area of computers).
I wanted to use my own samples in our midi sequences so when the GUS came
out I jumped on it. Soon after I learned the tricks of the trade on the
internet and started downloading demo's. Again I was amazed at what I was
hearing and seeing. I have a lot of respect for the coders and musicians
out there. Actually at our last concert I played a couple Mods while we
took our stuff down. (We're in the industrial genre).
When I have more time I would like to release a couple of my band's songs
in S3M. I just started programming at work for an image package we are
about to release. (It mainly deals with images from satellites.) So I
haven't had much time to think. But I enjoy keeping up with the demo
scene, it helps me keep in touch with my true passion, music.
Sorry to ramble on, but you asked for it. Thanks for all your effort
to keep the scene strong.
thare
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OooOOo. o
O `O O o
o O O o
O .o oOo O
oOooOO' .oOoO' `OoOo. o O o o O 'OoOo. .oOo.
o O o o O o O O o o O OooO'
O o O O o O o o O O o O
o' `OoO'o o `oO `OoOO Oo o' o O `OoO'
o
(Section 5) OoO'
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(The Party '94)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nothing much this week. 8( Next week might be a bit too early for us to
have reviews of all the demos, etc, but we should have at least a couple
party reports. Stay tuned!
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
o. O O o o o
Oo o o O O O
O O O O o o o
O o o o o O o
O o O .oOo. 'o O o O .oOo. o .oOo. .oOoO' .oOoO .oOo
o O O OooO' O o o O O O o O O o O o o O `Ooo.
o Oo O o O O `o Oo o O o o O o O O o O
O `o `OoO' `Oo'oO' `OoooO'O oOoO' Oo `OoO' `OoO'o `OoO'o `OoO'
O
(Section 6) o'
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
FILENAME.EXT LOCATION SIZE DESCRIPTION
------------ ---------------- ---- -----------------------------------------
.-----------.
| --DEMOS-- | (all locations start with /pub/msdos/demos...)
`-----------'
icy .zip /alpha/NEW 69 ICY - an Introduction to Insecabilis
santro .arj /alpha/NEW 498 SANTRO, a KLF production
sc94xmas.zip /alpha/NEW 310 Spontaneous Combustion '94 X-Mas Demo!
xmas94 .zip /alpha/NEW 115 Christmas '94 by Superiority Complex
xnnbogus.zip /alpha/NEW 31 Bogus Boutique BBS-Intro (GUS)
.-----------.
| --MUSIC-- | (all locations start with /pub/msdos/demos/music...)
`-----------'
bm-norm1.zip /disks Music disk by B00mer of Relic/Klf
bm-norm2.zip /disks
xmas94! .zip /disks Epinicion Christmas '94 Holiday music
sforge .zip /programs/samplers Sound Forge 3.0, for Windows
klf-unti.zip /songs/xm Untitled by Khyron / KLF
longstab.arj /songs/xm Longstabber by Vogue & LizardKing
destro_2.zip /songs/mtm
convert14.zip /programs/misc Sound file conversion program
crash .zip /songs/s3m Crash by Myzer/Legion
go .zip /songs/s3m Go by Pozor/TKB
hndrlnds.zip /songs/s3m Hunterlands by Myzer/Legion
inscream.zip /songs/s3m Inscream by Myzer/Legion
insights.zip /songs/s3m Insights by Myzer/Legion
ionosphr.zip /songs/s3m Ionosphere by Myzer/Legion
kinesis .lzh /songs/s3m Kinesis by Zigg
leavem .zip /songs/s3m Leave your mind by Pyc
maduar .zip /songs/s3m S3M by Lubomir Remiar
newage .zip /songs/s3m Newage by Myzer/Legion
nin-head.zip /songs/s3m Head Like a Hole by Bedlamite
now .zip /songs/s3m Now by Myzer/Legion
showme .zip /songs/s3m Show me by Mad/Hyperactive
solong .zip /songs/s3m So Long by Myzer/Legion
sunker .zip /songs/s3m Sunker by Satyricon
thezone .zip /songs/s3m The Zone by Myzer/Legion
tr-wntrs.zip /songs/s3m Wintersweet by tR/\Sh / Enigma
xmasrave.zip /songs/s3m Silent Night (X-Mas rave) by Humanoid
zaibatsu.zip /songs/s3m Zaibatsu Tears, 8 track by Myzer/Legion
.----------.
| --CODE-- | (all locations start with /pub/msdos/demos/code...)
`----------'
<Did not have time to move the code files this week>
.----------.
| --ART--- | (all locations start with /pub/msdos/demos/graphics...)
`----------'
<Did not have time to move the art files this week>
.----------.
| --MISC-- | (all locations start with /pub/msdos/demos...)
`----------'
epatoivo.zip /parties 71 Desperate Hours Nordic Line Party Report
snwired1.zip /parties 1400 Wired Party Report Part 1/5
snwired2.zip /parties 1400 " " " " 2/5
snwired3.zip /parties 1400 " " " " 3/5
snwired4.zip /parties 1400 " " " " 4/5
snwired5.zip /parties 117 " " " " 5/5
snwired!.zip /parties 47 Patch for Wired Party Report (SB,PAS)
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Oo oO
O O o o o o
o o O O
O Oo O
O o O o .oOo O .oOo O .oOoO' 'OoOo. .oOo
o O o O `Ooo. o O o O o o O `Ooo.
o O O o O O o O o O O o O
O o `OoO'o `OoO' o' `OoO' o' `OoO'o o O `OoO'
.oOOOo.
.O o
o
o
o .oOo. `OoOo. 'OoOo. .oOo. `OoOo.
O O o o o O OooO' o
`o .o o O O O o O O
(Section 7) `OoooO' `OoO' o o O `OoO' o
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Merry Christmas! This evening, our listserver on the North Pole is
delivering your copy of demonews by sleigh. Actually, some dude named Santa
is taking over the job just for tonight. If your copy of DemoNews is a
little late, don't worry, because apparently that dude has gotta deliver a
bunch of other shit tonight too. Because its Christmas, my column this week
is a little shorter then usual, but thats mainly because I've got to do the
usual Christmas dinner + open presents + drink spiked eggnog + sleigh
shooting + listen to DECEMBER.S3M + go to church routine. This week's
interview was supposed to be with Santa Claus, but because he was not
available, we had to settle for Purple Motion of Future Crew. Okay, enough
cheeze whiz, lets get on with the music section. =)
Seriously, I hope that you all have a great Christmas! I'd like to send
some BIG greetings this week to: Edge of EMF and Lord Soth of iCE, they
both helped me out a lot this week when I was in a bind.
This week's interview is the one that I've been REALLY excited about
getting. Purple Motion is one of the guys that I think many of us actually
worship. Our church even has a seperate Purple Motion alter, as I'm sure
your's does too. Go grab yourself a beverage and enjoy the interview!
Remember to extinguish your fireplace before you go to bed!
Ryan Cramer
rcramer1@osf1.gmu.edu
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
______ __ _______ __ __
| __ \.--.--.----.-----.| |.-----. | | |.-----.| |_|__|.-----.-----.
| __/| | | _| _ || || -__| | || _ || _| || _ | |
|___| |_____|__| | __||__||_____| |__|_|__||_____||____|__||_____|__|__|
|__|
INTERVIEW: Purple Motion of Future Crew
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Before I say anything else, I'd like to thank Edge of EMF. Without him,
this interview would not have been possible. Purple Motion doesn't have
easy access to internet, nor does he speak very good English. As a result,
the interview had to be translated from Finnish to English, and corrected
for grammer, spelling, etc. Edge did a great job with it and I really
appreciate it. Edge is headed off to the Army very soon, but when he
returns next year, we may be seeing a lot more stuff from him in DemoNews.
Purple Motion doesn't really need much of description, in fact, no
description could do this musician justice; he is quite simply THE most
famous musician in the entire PC demoscene. His music is known throughout
the scene, and he has remained at the number one position in the charts
ever since Future Crew's Unreal demo was released in 1992. Purple Motion
has a style that you can recognize anywhere, and he's kept with this
signature since the very beginning. It gives his music a very refreshing
professional sound, and his melodies are some of the best that I've heard
in any music, tracked or recorded. Purple Motion produces some of the most
inspirational music that you will hear; his music gets you excited about
the demoscene! His music with Skaven's music is also part of what drove
Future Crew to be the leading group in the scene. Purple Motion's works can
be found in a number of productions and individual releases. It would be
close to impossible to list everything here, but some of the major releases
which included his music are: FishTro, Unreal, Panic, WorldCharts,
Assembly'93 intro, Second Reality, Journey 1 & 2 music disks, Scenial disk
magazine, and many others! Enjoy the interview!
PM = Jonne Valtonen - [Purple Motion/FC] - purple.motion@pcb.mpoli.fi
RC = Ryan Cramer - [Iguana/Renaissance] - rcramer1@osf1.gmu.edu
(with help from) - [Edge/EMF]
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
[start of interview]
RC: How old are you, and whats your current occupation (ie: school,
job, etc)? Where are you located?
PM: I'm 18 and doing my last year in High School. I live in Kaarina,
Finland.
RC: Which music would you say you're most influenced by? (both tracked
and recorded)
PM: Rob Hubbard, Vangelis, and perhaps Enigma...
RC: What process do you use when composing a song?
PM: First I sample a whole bunch of samples and put them all into one
module. Then I think of some melodies and make a few patterns
of the main theme. After that I make a secondary theme (a couple of
patterns) followed some variations of the melodies, slower parts, etc.
Usually all my melodies in a single song are quite similar nowadays,
since that tends to make the tune more "catchy". Then I make the
beginning, which is usually a totally separate part which brings up the
mood. There are, of course exceptions, like Inside Out, which goes
straight to the main theme. Usually my songs consists of the main
melody, and variations of it, I consider structure an integral
part of the song. I also play the chords on my keyboard. Sometimes I
first make a MIDI version of the song before the S3M, like in the
soundtrack for Probe (which hasn't been released, but will be put on
a CD of mine when I get around to making it from my other hurries).
RC: What do you think of these new tracking programs which have
recently been released? Such as Fast Tracker II, and Extreme
Tracker. How do you compare them to ST3?
PM: Of course it's hard to compare them because I'm so used to the ST3
interface that it would take a prohibitively long time for me to get
used to other trackers. I think I won't ever start using another
tracker, but instead go straight to MIDI. I do use FT2 to sample,
it's the easiest way I've found yet. Congratulations to Triton on
that one! (The idea of envelopes in instruments is also quite
fascinating).
RC: How much do you bench press?
PM: 130 kilos, which is 287 pounds.
RC: What do you think is your best piece of music? Which music are you
most proud of? How about your worst? :)
PM: Currently I like my compotune for The Party 94 (no name yet) and
Inside Out is quite nice. Shadowrun's melodies were good, but
technically it's quite lacking since I made it in a hurry. I've
heard Second Reality's music so many times that it nearly makes me
puke, so I can't judge that one. Hullu.s3m also has its own good sides :)
My worst song is, incidentally, also my first one and was lost to
the world some years ago in a hard disk crash. Of my released music,
Panic's soundtrack is one that I'm not especially proud of.
RC: What equipment and software do you use for composing and
sampling?
PM: I sample with FT2 and edit the samples in Digiplay 3. Sometimes I
borrow my friends' guitars, synths and effect processors. For MIDI
composing I use Atari ST and Cubase, on the PC Cakewalk Pro.
RC: One of the things that I'm most impressed with about your music is
the many styles of music that you are able to compose. What do you
consider to be your most favorite style of music to compose?
PM: Thanks for the compliment :) You learn a lot by trying to compose
different styles. I have some first attempts at certain styles you
wouldn't want to hear, but gradually you learn to make better songs
of the style. This is vital in going into commercial business where
you might be called upon to make any kind of song for a game. (Like
Benjamin and the Alien Incident, which will be out 1995). I especially
like composing Vangelis and Enigma style music.
RC: What projects are you currently doing music for?
PM: Benjamin and the Alien Incident, a car game by Epic Megagames,
Illuminatus (a space game), my hometown's youth theater and of
course that CD I was talking about.
RC: What are your plans for the future? Do you think you will continue
with music as a job in the future?
PM: Absolutely. I will try to get to a musical institute and if I don't
get accepted, I will keep on trying until I do. My dream is to make
the soundtrack for a movie :)
RC: What inspires you to make music? For some people, its hearing other
people's music, or finding/making some nice samples. For some,
life's experiences can be an inspiration. What do you consider to
be the most inspiring facet to making music?
PM: Good equipment inspires me the most. If you have excellent sounds,
you just have to make a song out of them. Sometimes I just get this
urge to make something. It's hard to explain, but I guess you all
know the feeling. You can extinguish a lot of yourself into the music
you make.
RC: A lot of people in the scene are very influenced by your music. As
a result, many people try to copy your style and rip your samples.
What do you think of this? Does this make you feel good or does it
disappoint you?
PM: I think it's quite flattering, in fact. I have copied other peoples'
techniques and samples but I've never released those songs. I just
try to learn everyone's style and merge it into my own style. I don't
find ripping samples lame, but ripping samples and using them in exactly
the same fashion as in the original song is very lame. I have noticed
several people doing this with my songs, and I would prefer if those
people tried to develop their own styles rather than copying mine.
There is a difference between being a copier and an artist. You always
have to try test your limits and get new ideas, and the worst case is
when you're stuck and copy other people's techniques. Remixes are
completely another story, they're quite OK in my opinion.
RC: From a composers point of view, how do you think your music has
changed over the years? From a listeners point of view, ALL of your
music sounds good, from your Unreal music, to your most recent
stuff. How do you think your music has changed?
PM: I've tried to make it sound more natural and realistic, as far as
possible from the traditional tracker-sound. I've abandoned lots of
my old techniques and constantly tried new stuff to try accomplish
this. Now that I have several sources for my own samples, it makes
"different" songs easier to make when the reliance on other peoples'
samples is negligible.
RC: Is there any additional things that you'd like to say or anybody
that you would like to send greetings to?
PM: Greetings to Edge (who also translated this text into English in a phone
conversation), all those who have written a letter to me (sorry
for not replying to some people, but I'm a lousy letter writer and
in a constant so I would prefer e-mail). Especially Greg, sorry for
not replying yet, I just haven't had the time! Please don't send
letters before Summer, I'm in a real hurry with my high school final
exams. Also greets to all the great guys I know, Lizardking, $volkraq,
Fractal and the rest. (I'm positive I'm forgetting some people now,
please forgive me :))
RC: Thanks for taking the time to do this interview!
PM: No prob! (actually, this was more of a bother to Edge :))
[end of interview]
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
(Interview with Krystall/Astek,KLF,Symptom by Snowman)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This week, we have an interview with Krystall of Astek. Krystall won the
international Music Contest 1 held last year, and went on to place second
in Music Contest ][. Two of his songs have even been pressed on the well-
reviewed Escape demo CD.
Patrick (Krystall) is from Quebec, and french is his native language. He
belongs to several groups: Astek, KLF, and Symptom, and music is his
calling. As of now, he still has yet to take part in a major demo
production.
Krystall is one of the first people I met in the scene and one might even
say that we have "roots" together. Over time, Patrick has consistently
been a calm individual who does not like to critisize others. Further, he
has earned Canada's respect in the music aspect of the demo scene. It is
with great pleasure that Patrick agreed to meet with me for this article.
His numerous achievements and success have prompted this interview.
SM = Christopher G. Mann - [Snowman/HORNET] - r3cgm@dax.cc.uakron.edu
KY = Patrick Matte - [Krystall/Astek] - krystall@biko.llc.org
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
[start of interview: December 20, 1994, 00:28GMT]
SM: How old are you? What's your occupation (student, etc) and where do
where do you live?
KY: I'm 19... I'm in 2nd grade at Cegep, in computer science. Cegep is
a kind of college here in Quebec. I live about 30 minutes from Quebec
city, in Cap-sante.
SM: What group are you in? Can you describe its history and future?
KY: The group I'm in is called Astek. It was founded about 3 years ago
by Jaydee, as a local ansi group. All members were from the Quebec city
area. The group released a few packs and then the ansi section left out.
Just before that, I joined and started to release some music under the
'astek' label. At the end of MC1, we found another musician, Soundwave,
and asked him to join. That's why Astek turned out as a little music
group. For the future, we plan to release a music disk, called
Incantation, very soon. Featuring music by the one and only Ryan
Cramer, Soundwave and me.
SM: I heard a little rumor that Necros might be contributing a song to the
music disk as well. Can you confirm?
KY: I can't confirm anything but Necros is interested in the project.
There will be a song from him if he have time to finish it before the
release.
SM: How long have you been in the demo scene, and would you describe your
past musical experience?
KY: I started to get interested in demos when I saw Spacepigs' megademo.
I liked the fact that is was very smooth on my poor XT. But for
the music part, I only started composing one year and a half ago, when
Ultra Tracker came out. It was the first 'usable' tracker for GUS.
SM: What trackers have you used, and why did you abandon Ultra Tracker?
KY: Like I said before, I started with Ultra tracker. I abandonned it
because, at a certain time, there was a fashion around Farandole here in
America. I started to work with it, and I loved the interface. It was
a very great tracker and I wish it would have been finished. Then, ST3
came out, and all the functions were already implemented, so I switched.
I like ST3 better right now, but I still think that the tracker has an
effect on the style of music one can compose.
SM: Do you do music outside the demo scene?
KY: Not a lot right now, but me and one of my friends, who is a true
musical genius, are working on some 'out-of-the-scene' projects.
SM: What inspires most of your music?
KY: I'm mostly inspired by other people's music. I spend a lot of time
listening to music, and I get some ideas from other songs.
SM: Of all the songs that you have done, which ones are your favorite?
KY: I think the one I like the most is called 'Sweet Rhapsody'. It's an
ULT I made a long time ago, but it was true inspiration. It took me
about 2 hours to complete it and the melody was quite good. I also
like some of my newer tunes, like the Guardian of Souls I made for
MC2. One of my friends and I even wrote lyrics for it.
SM: What would you list as your 3 greatest accomplishments in the scene?
KY: Hmm... that's a tricky question. ;) Let's say my 1st place at the
MC1, my 2nd place at the MC2 and my 2 songs on the Escape demo cd.
I wish I could have made music for a demo, but down here, coders
aren't easy to find.
SM: I was told that you were considering recording Guardian of Souls
(the MC2 2nd place winner) in a studio. Do you have plans for this?
KY: Yes, it should be recorded in a little studio here. We are presently
re-doing the song in midi so that it can be played thru a beautiful
sounding synth. ;) It will be sung by a girl that goes to my school.
I'll tell you all more when it's finished!
SM: What musicians do you have the most respect for in the scene?
KY: The musicians I have a lot of respect for are the ones that can do
true music, not just a bunch of electronic notes. I like what Ryan
Cramer does a lot. I also love Necros' orchestral style. I had the
chance to see him do a song live, and I can tell you that it's
impresive.
SM: Musically, what are your goals for the future?
KY: I wish to improve my musical capabilities, to be more original. I
also want to release an album, but it's not for now.
SM: This is a bit off the subject, but why does Necros like Molson XXX beer?
KY: Hehe... it's quite an inside joke. We went to a party in Quebec
city, called the Balcon, and people bought that beer called Molson XXX
with a little more alcohol than in other kind of beers. I guess Necros
liked it a little too much. It was something to see, we were all talking
in english except for Necros who was speaking in french.
SM: You've been in the scene for about 2 years now. What trends are
appearing that you don't like?
KY: The thing I don't like about the demo scene is that there are too
many groups that are started 'just for fun'. The kind of groups that
do nothing but say they are good. It's not the kind of thing I like.
SM: What groups do you think set a good example for the scene then?
KY: I know this sounds a little odd, but Future Crew is a good example.
Each member has a precise task, and they are all very good in their
task. The group has good organization.
SM: What thoughts do you have on Composers Competition?
KY: I think it was a good way to put together a nice collection of songs.
I'm not angry or anything against Mike Phillips because he didn't
finish the contest. Like he would say: "The demo scene is just a
hobby". We can't judge people that are miles away.
SM: Thanks for taking the time to do this interview. Is there anything
else that you would like to add?
KY: I would like to thank all the people that helped me with music,
especially Jaydee, Daniel Potter, Necros and you. And to all, keep
up the good work, let the american demo scene become the best!
[end of interview: December 20, 1994, 01:30GMT]
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-- COMMON SENSE TWO, OR, IN DEFENSE OF 16 CHANNELS --
[Note: The staff at HORNET and DemoNews does not necessarily support or
agree with the following viewpoints expressed. Any response should be
directed to PeriSoft at ew23@cornell.edu]
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm no great musician, and, based on what people have said, I'm certainly
no great artist ;>, but I have noticed the bias towards 4 channel music and
against those who compose with 8 or even <GASP> 16 channels.
(And I quote from DEMONEWS issue #75, GFX section)
...
" The maximum amount of colors should stay 256 because the possibility of "
" scanned pictures. This is something like the restrictions of music- "
" competitions because, as all music-composers will confirm, it's easier to "
" do a module with 16 or 32 channels instead of 4. "
As you can see, the basic bigotry runs even into the uncivilized and vermin
infested areas of "graphics" which I believe has to do with 'pixels', which
are little dots that 'artists' go around making one of 256 colors, trying
in vain to make some sort of meaningful shape. ;> [Stony: No offense.. :>]
So the argument is this: "It's easier to write music in 4 channels than to
write music in 16 channels."
That's a pretty ridiculous statement.
In fact, it's rather like saying it's easier to code on a 486 than on a
286, so everybody should use the 286!
Yeah! Jeez, man, it's so easy to do that stuff on a 486 that it's like
cheating! Isn't it a lot easier to write code for a 486? Yeah!
Well, you say, people do more complicated things on 486s!
And I say, "ah hah!!!" because that is my point. Four channel music is fine
for 'simpler' music but it's just impossible to do more complicated
melodies or drums, that are possible, and not easier to do, by the way, in
16 channel.
It may well be easier to write four channel music in 16 channels, but it's
noteeasier to write *16* channel music in 16 channels!
We should no sooner limit musicians to four channels by an ancient amiga
standard than limit coders to 286 demos by an ancient 1986 standard.
Dog bless you, and thank you for your support.
--PeriSoft [Epi/InA/Defi]
Note: If you want to hear some songs that may explain why I believe as I
do, try \demos\songs\s3m\defi-can.zip and defi-wha.zip. Listen to 'em in
ST3 with the 18 track viewer and you'll see. :) You can flame me at: ;>
<ew23@cornell.edu>
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
.oOOOo. o
.O o O
o o
o o
o .oOo. .oOoO .oOo. `OoOo. .oOo
O O o o O OooO' o `Ooo.
`o .o o O O o O O O
`OoooO' `OoO' `OoO'o `OoO' o `OoO'
.oOOOo.
.O o
o
o
o .oOo. `OoOo. 'OoOo. .oOo. `OoOo
O O o o o O OooO' o
`o .o o O O O o O O
(Section 8) `OoooO' `OoO' o o O `OoO' o
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
(Its X-Mas in Africa)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Wow, it's Christmas tomorrow already. It seems to have crept up on me this
year, I seem to have somehow ignored all the shopping store hype (no mean
feat, let me assure you)
In fact, I got a nasty shock a few days ago when it was time to buy
presents for my family ... I realised, as I do every year, that I have a
family of seven, various friends, aunts, uncles, grandparents etc., while
as a student I am permanently short of funds. I managed though, just like
I do every year.
There has been a lot more stuff on TV recently, mostly old American stuff
which the local stations try to pawn off as "Quality Entertainment". The
last few nights I have turned on the television, it has been about small
groups of Americans blowing up numerous enemy armies, all the members of
which seem to be exremely bad shots. Ho Ho Ho.
Then again, I shouldn't be nasty ... you should see some of the local stuff
_we_ put out.
I went to the local mall the other day, and there was a Santa sitting in
white cotton which was supposed to be snow, but it's summer during
Christmas time down here, so it hard for cotton wool to look like snow at
40 to 45 degrees centigrade (Sorry, don't know the farenheit conversion)
I know Santa's manager, so we had a bit of a chat while Santa made a
spirited attempt to look jolly. It didn't work, but the kids didn't seem
to mind and looked like they were enjoying themselves.
The point I'm trying to make is that down here in South Africa (East
coast), visions of gentle snow, sticking to the windowsill while reindeer
prance around in the snow outside just doesn't work. Santa wears shorts,
and a reindeer would probably die of heat exaustion.
One great thing about summer and christmas though is the storms. We get
these lovely great big loud things, with raindrops that sting and water
flooding our front door. We will often set up chairs just inside our glass
patio door and watch the amazing lightning displays ... no lights on in the
house, and every electrical appliance unplugged from the walls ... you all
know what happens when you leave them in.
Yep, Christmas is fun, with all the Smith clan converging on our house and
eating possibly more then is wise. Round about this time I hang up my
keyboard until I have recovered, usually three days later.
Oh well, the daily lightning storm is brewing, the thunder is loud, it's
going to be a good one, it is time for me to unplug my PC. Merry christmas
for tomorrow, and I expect to see at least seven Xmas Intros in my email
account by Tuesday :-)
Byeeee.... - Denthor denthor@beastie.cs.und.ac.za
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
(Interview with Maxwood/Majic 12 by Snowman)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Maxwood is arguably one of the best demo coders in the scene today. Even a
year and half ago when "Wish" was released, it was obvious that the group
Majic 12 knew what they were doing. Earlier this year, Majic 12 released
the demo called "Show". This offering has given them more international
recognition and secured their standing in the demo scene.
Releasing "Show" placed Maxwood as one of the top coders world wide. His
main strength lies in speed and optimization of effects. What he can
squeeze out of a 386 is incredible.
The interview with Maxwood had to be conducted via e-mail, so it was not
live.
SM = Christopher G. Mann - [Snowman/HORNET] - r3cgm@dax.cc.uakron.edu
MX = Anal Tamas - [Maxwood/Majic 12] - maxwood@rs3.szif.hu
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
[start of interview:
December 19, 1994]
SM: What is your current occupation (student, etc)? How old are you? Where
are you located?
MX: Actually I'm studying in the local college here in Gyor, but as the first
half of this year finished (except the exams), I'm mostly trying to sleep
a lot, and have fun. I'm 18 anyway.
SM: For the record, who are the members of your group?
MX: This little list shows you only the PC side of us.
- Maxwood (coder)
- Rack (graphician)
- Chorus & Sid (musician)
- Elijah (musician, graphician)
SM: Do most of them live in Hungary? Also, is communication within the
group ever a problem?
MX: Well, only Chorus & Sid aren't Hungarian, as you probably know. I can't
imagine communication problems with 4 people. Maybe the snail post can
slow down our connection to Chorus & Sid. But it's not a problem as we
don't swap 0 day wares. :-)
SM: Where did you get your start in coding?
MX: I started on C64, and about 1991-1992 I moved to PC.
SM: How has the Amiga influenced the way you code on the PC?
MX: I can say thanks for the Amiga, with its wonderful things. My brother
coded on the Amiga, so I couldn't use it myself. I had to code on the
PC, which seemed to be much worse than the Amiga at that time. Well,
my opinions haven't changed over time. I think there still are a
lot of people who should have to see the old Amiga demos so they have
an understanding of what they have to fly over.
SM: A little over 1.5 years ago, there was a review of Wish in World
Charts. There were several comments in that review about problems
with the code and music in the demo. Do you feel that those comments
were accurate?
MX: Huh, that was so far in the past. As I remember, most of the problem was
the Trident bug, and they were right with this. Well, they didn't like
the main tune. I have to say they were also right about this. I found
that tune on an old disk in the dusty loft. :-)
I really don't remember what they wrote for the graphics, maybe something
like those graphics were on Amiga before. But not every PC owner has
seen an Amiga. And I think the quality of those gfxs were ruling in
their time.
SM: Since Wish was released, what other productions have you done?
MX: As I remember NewIntro, Poor, Show, and Face. And of course I converted
a few issues of our magazines TS and PO7. Oh, and I made an invitation
for the Hammering '94.
SM: In all of your demos, what effects do you like the best?
MX: My favorites are those which I used some more time than average to
optimize. For example from Show the rotated-morphed dotball with 10000
dots, the dot tunnel with 9000 dots, and maybe the double-rotator in the
Face. Actually I have some new hit routines, but now I wouldn't want to
write down them.
Have you ever seen the Face on a Trident VGA? It puts 1 cube to the
screen, but in 2 frames. Wow!
SM: Some of the effects you did in Show were the fastest I've ever seen
in a demo. Do you have any suggestions to PC coders out there about
how to optimize their routines?
MX: There are a lot of way how to code, what to optimize. The most powerful
optimization is to find the fastest method to do the routines. I mean you
will never make a fast dot-channel if you calculate every point real time,
you should put 1 pixel with 1 instruction. And if you can, precalculate.
If you're finished with these things, maybe you can increase the speed
with less instructions, or code-optimization. But the first thing is to
find out what is the fastest method to do.
SM: What plans do you have for the future? (The Party 1994, etc.)
MX: We wanted to go to The Party IV, but finally we won't be there. But I
hope it will succeed, and a lot of groups will come with new hits.
For future plans, we would like to finish our new demo about April, and
continue making our 2nd game. Our 1st game will be in the stores about
Jan-Feb 1995. Be sure to Check It Out!
For this year we'll convert Chorus & Sid's musicdisk from the Amiga which
is about one year old now. But if you like coffee and blues you'll like
it. We planning another musicdisk for January-February, 1 demo for
February, and one more for about April.
SM: Thank you for taking the time to do this interview.
MX: Thank you too. It was funny to do. I hope you all the best with doing
DemoNews. Great thing! Keep the quality.
[end of interview: December 19, 1994]
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
(Assembly Part-II - "Implementation Optimization" By Jason Nunn)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Merry Christmas ("Ho bloody Ho"),
This segment is the second part in my series of assembly coding. Here I
will be discussing the relative speeds of the current benchmark computer
"i486-DX". I've been very busy lately with a tracker I'm finishing and a
new demo. I've been putting this article off for a while, Snowman has been
pressing me for this thing and he wants it by tonight..arrgghhhh. I wanted
to waffle on a lot more about this topic, but looks like I may have to
continue it to another part :)..Oh well, you get that, on with the show.
Hands up those of you that have studied Operating Systems at uni?. Yep, ok
now, who remembers the first lesson of Operating Systems? ..hmmm, anybody?.
Well the first thing I was told is that you can never scientifically
analyze any program for it's performance. There is only one way to find
out how optimized, or effective something is, and that is to take it out
into the field a test it!.
For those of you that are using TASM, you will know of a book called Quick
Reference that is dedicated to describing the speeds of the various Intel
instruction codes. Now this book is good. Very good, it does lack some
description, but it's still very comprehensive when describing the speeds
and efficiency of the instructions.
There is only one problem, and the problem is on page 63 labelled Clocks.
This page specifies a set of unrealistic assumptions that are broken every
0.00001 of a second or so in normal operation. There are a few assumptions
that hold, like the alignment of instructions etc, but the bus holds and
the wait states are totally unrealistic. One of the biggest assumptions
that makes these figures so dicky is that the instructions are prefetched
and decoded. That is, it's not taking into account the actual size of the
instruction, and the time to takes to read it from memory to the CPU!.
To solve this, were going to have to write a program that tests instruc-
tions in a relative form. As you know, there are more than two ways of
achieving the same thing. For example, loading an effective address with a
LEA does the same thing as a loading an effective address with a MOV.
Setting the value of a register using MOV, can be achieved by using a PUSH
or POP series. This is called Implementation Optimization, and it what
coders do to improve the speed of their code. We're now ready to test some
instructions using a program I wrote for this topic.
I've given this program to Snowman and to who ever wants it, so that you
can perform your own tests. The program executes a given instruction over
and over again for exactly 1.098901099~ seconds. Every time the instruc-
tion is executed, a counter is incremented. After the time period, a final
tally is arrived. When you subtract the CPU time used to actually operate
the overhead (ie the rest of the program) from this tally, you get the
approximate speed of the instruction. The higher the scale, the slower the
Instruction.
For curiosities sake, I first tested all possible register clearing
methods. The idea here is to set a given register to zero. Most of you have
probably read demo source code, and you may have read various author notes
about the topic. Some authors say that XOR is faster on a i486 (including
me ..well I did), and others say that MOV's are faster. The main ideology
behind all this is that one instruction could be better designed than
another. Well, the results below will settle this once and for all:
8-bit register | MOV AL,0 51625 | XOR AL,AL 51625
16-bit register | MOV AX,0 99565 | XOR AX,AX 99565
32-bit register | MOV EAX,0 51625 | XOR EAX,EAX 51625
Here we can conclude that there is no difference between clearing a
register with a MOV instruction and clearing it with an XOR instruction. It
shows that using the 16 bit codes tend to be half the speed. I've also
tried this with other general registers (EDX,ECX and EBX), all of them came
up with the same results.
LEA EAX,[HELLO] 51625
There's a lot of noise about the LEA instruction being slower than a MOV on
the i486 when loading an effective address. Well, according to my results,
this is not so. It doesn't matter whether you use a MOV or a LEA to load
an address into a register. I've also tried this using other general
registers and I got the same results.
The next set of instructions I was eager to study was the multiply set.
These instructions perform multiplication. The first one I tested was the
conventional MUL instruction:
MOV EAX,100h
MOV ECX,5
MUL ECX 509986
I then compared this with the old method of multiplying constants with
variables. Back in the old days, if one of your factors was a constant
number, you would use a calculation as follows:
MOV EAX,100h
MOV EBX,EAX
SHL EAX,2
ADD EAX,EBX 224844
The idea behind this algorithm is that any possible number has can by made
up of set of binary log bases (ie 1,2,4,8,16 etc). Therefore, you can
accomplish a multiply just by using a series of shifts. If you don't
understand what I'm going on about, then don't worry. This will be
discussed in much more detail in Programming Techniques. This algorithm
like the last one. It multiplies 100 by 5 was the answer ending up in EAX.
As you can see by the result, this method has over twice the speed of our
486 multiply instruction.
Well, the above method was the old way of doing this. Now with the
386/486's LEA instruction, here is the new way of multiplying 100 by 5:
MOV EAX,100h
LEA EAX,[EAX*4+EAX] 185875
MOV ECX,100h
LEA ECX,[ECX*4+ECX] 144218
Using an LEA for multiplication is more than 3 times faster than a
conventional MUL instruction. The surprising thing that I discovered is
that using EAX as a factor produces a slower instruction, as the second
instruction that uses ECX is faster. Note that I've tried this using EDX
and EBX, both produce the same result as ECX. This requires further
investigation.
Ok, what about loops?...Well, you ask anybody. Everybody (probably even
Snowman), has an opinion on "what's faster" when it comes to loop
constructs. Well, again, here we will settle this once and for all.
@@TEST_LOOP
MOV ECX,10
@@TEST_LOOP: LOOP 1016412
MOV ECX,10
@@TEST_LOOP:
DEC ECX
JNZ @@TEST_LOOP 836366
I've heard a few people say to me that LOOP's are faster on these new
machines. According to my results, this isn't the case. LOOP may look
compact and appear to be overall smaller, but in reality, it operates far
less efficiently. The DEC and a JNZ instructions are much more faster than
the conventional LOOP instruction.
The Intel family has a series of computational instructions dedicated to
manipulating the accumulator register (ie ADD, SUB, AND, OR). This means
that you have a super fast instruction that processes a dedicated register.
For example, a ADD EAX,3 is faster than a ADD ECX,3. Here are the results
that all achieve the task of incrementing a register:
INC BL 51632 INC AL 51632
INC BX 99564 INC AX 99569
INC EBX 51632 INC EAX 51632
ADD BL,1 51632 ADD AL,1 51632
ADD BX,1 99569 ADD AX,1 99569
ADD EBX,1 51632 ADD EAX,1 51632
It appears that there is no difference in processing speed of a ADD or a
INC. We could say the same thing about SUB and DEC, but this will have to
be checked. Right now, we will assume it to be true. Another noticeable
observation is that there is no speed difference between a EAX operation
and a EBX.ECX etc operation. Previous generations of Intel did have a
speed difference.
You will also notice that 16 bit operations are slower (a general
observation). I think enough has been said about this area. I also did a
speed test on PUSH, POP PUSHA etc. Again, 16 bit operations are far
slower. Where ever you can, always compute, store, process (whatever), in
32 bit or 8 bit registers, never in 16 bit only when it's necessary. I
would say that the 386 16 bit code has been ripped off the 286/186 chip
without any improvements. Using this instructions may achieve the same
performance as an actual 286 (this is only a theory).
Well, I'm going to stop here. This was just to give you an idea in the way
the 486 processes instructions. I've now revealed several patterns, you
can fill in the gaps. Although I haven't done a separate test in Real
Mode, I would be presuming them to be the same. Although I wouldn't put
money on it. If there is enough demand, then I will conduct a test of
these instructions under real mode.
Well, I hope you find this useful. One or two of the finding has certainly
made me have a big rethink about the way I code.
Seeya
:Jason Nunn
Super Real Darwin! - Demo Group
Darwin, NT, Australia
Contact: jsno@amigar.apana.org.au (Amiga Retreat BBS - Home of Pain)
Merry Christmas ("Ho bloody Ho"),
[Below is the source code to demotest.asm. If you know how to uudecode and
upzip, you're in business. If you don't, just ignore the following garbage.]
begin 600 demotest.zip
M4$L#!!0 @ ( )NBF!V1$025L@0 +L0 , 1$5-3U1%4U0N05--U5=?
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M!K F'YZ,Z!K?BGR@7G'.1?'_GH]X>8*GT7[Q\Q]02P$"% 4 ( " ";HI@=
MD1$$E;($ "[$ # ! " 1$5-3U1%4U0N05--4$L%
3!@ ! $ .@ -P$ !
end
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Oo
o O o
O o O O
oOooOoOo oOo oOo
o O `OoOo. o O .oOo o .oOo
O o o O o `Ooo. O `Ooo.
o O O o O O o O
O. O o `oO o' `OoO' `oO `OoO'
.oOOOo.
.O o
o
o
o .oOo. `OoOo. 'OoOo. .oOo. `OoOo.
O O o o o O OooO' o
`o .o o O O O o O O
(Section 9) `OoooO' `OoO' o o O `OoO' o
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
-- A RESPONSE TO COMMON SENCE ][ BY STONY --
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This message is in response to PeriSoft's article (in Musicians Corner).
PeriSoft's article was forwarded to by Snowman in time to have my thoughts
included for this issue of DemoNews.
What I attempted to explain in DemoNews 075 was that it is easier to do
graphics at a high resolution than at a low resolution. This does not mean
that graphics should be done at a low resolution, but rather the graphics
competitions themselves should be divided into different sections as per the
resolutions I explained last time.
Of course I'm no musician, but in my opinion it is more difficult to do
decent modules with 4 channels because you must be consious of the
limitations. With 8 or 16 channels, you just can add instruments to make
it sound nicer. I DON'T say that only 4 channels modules should be
composed and YES I know, modules with increased channels will sound nicer
if done well.
I am sorry that I referred to an area in which I have very little experience
and what PeriSoft wrote will be true because he is, after all, a musician.
The fact that technology is changing very fast is a positive point. It is
now possible to do complicated effects which were not possible on the older
systems. In addition, the music is getting better because of the new
soundcards. The same thing applies to graphics. Of course it is nice
doing 24 bit graphics with 16.7 million of colors because it all looks more
realistic.
But... the main point I wanted to make clear is that the competitions should
remain competitions. I am NOT saying that only 286 code, 4 channel music,
and CGA should remain acceptable for competitions. But, what I am trying
to say is that there should be different sections for each competition (i.e.
in the music competition 4 sections: 4, 8, 16 and 32 channels)
From now on I will try not to refer to an area in which I have little
experience. :)
The next article will be a sort of report about the Party 4 which comences
next week.
Merry Christmas to all of you and best wishes for 1995 !!
...Stony
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Oo o
o O O
O o o
oOooOoOo o
o O .oOoO .oOo
O o o O `Ooo.
o O O o O
(Section 10) O. O `OoO'o `OoO'
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
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.oOOOo. o ooOoOOo (Section 11)
o o O O
O O o o
oOooOO. o O
o `O .oOoO' .oOo O o o .oOo .oOo O o .oOo. .oOo
O o O o O OoO O `Ooo. `Ooo. o O OooO' `Ooo.
o .O o O o o O O O O O o O O
`OooOO' `OoO'o `OoO' O o ooOOoOo `OoO' `OoO' `OoO'o `OoO' `OoO'
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
After reading this issue of DemoNews, you may be wondering how you can get
previous ones. Well fear not! There are two different ways to do so:
1: FTP to hornet.eng.ufl.edu and go to /pub/msdos/demos/news/OLD_NEWS and
start downloading anything you see.
2: Now you can request back issues of DemoNews via e-mail. Start a letter
to listserver@oliver.sun.ac.za (any subject line) and in the body of the
letter include "GET DEMUAN-LIST <INDEX>" where INDEX refers to the
index number of the issue.
For example: GET DEMUAN-LIST 29
This would retrieve DemoNews #70 (index number 29).
Issue Index Date Size Description
----- ----- -------- ------ ----------------------------------------------
70 29 11/13/94 45558 HORNET the New Team, Review of Epidemic Music
Disk, Review of Fast Tracker ][, Dynamic
Tracker Response.
71 31 11/20/94 40430 Streamlining HORNET, NAID, Interview with
Basehead, More on Fast Tracker ][, Denthor's
First Article.
72 32 11/27/94 63343 Goodbye Michelle, Interview with Skaven/FC,
Review of Extreme's Tracker, Asphyxia Lives,
Stony's First Article.
73 35,36 12/04/94 78819 History of HORNET, Editorial: Demo Dreams,
Interview with Necros, Lemmings + Psycho
Neurosis, Review of PMODE/W, Using Assembly
Part 1.
74 37,38 12/11/94 77833 Interview with Vic/AcmE, Editorial: A Defence
of Demoscene, The Making of NAID / Apraxia,
Interview with C.C.Catch, Review of Scream
Tracker 3.2, Review of Autodesk Animator Pro.
75 41,42 12/18/94 68009 A DemoNews Reader, The Birth of Commercial
Life, Editorial: Calm Before the Storm,
Interview with Mello-D, US Demo Scene
(Renaissance meeting), Jelly Tots and Pizza
Shops, Review of Wired '94 Graphics.
For more recent issues that are split into multiple parts, you must send
an individual ruquest for each index number.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
(Section 12) .oOOOo. o
.O o O o
o o
o O
o o .oOo. .oOo O 'OoOo. .oOoO
O O O o `Ooo. o o O o O
`o .o o o O O O O o O o
`OoooO' Oo `OoO' `OoO' o' o O `OoOo
O
.oOOOo. OoO'
.O o
o O
o oOo
o .oOo. `oOOoOO. `oOOoOO. .oOo. 'OoOo. o .oOo
O O o O o o O o o OooO' o O O `Ooo.
`o .o o O o O O o O O O O o o O
`OoooO' `OoO' O o o O o o `OoO' o O `oO `OoO'
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
"It's not what we eat, but what we digest that makes us strong; not what we
gain, but what we save that makes us rich; not what we read but what we
remember that makes us learned; and not what we profess but what we
practice that makes us [who we are]." - Francis Bacon
Warning: The next issue of DemoNews will probably be very small compared
to this week's whopper. If you have anything to contribute, just
send it my way.
Merry Christmas!
-Christopher G. Mann (Snowman)-
r3cgm@dax.cc.uakron.edu
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-End.of.DemoNews.076.
