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Breakaway Debates on Moden Marxism Volume 1 Issue 2

  


Voila. Une miracle formidable! ;)))

Issue number two of Breakaway is here!

And this time, my Internet account won't make any trouble, 'cause
I've got a brand new account. So be sure to test it by submitting to
<vidarh@powertech.no> ;-)

By the way, a notice about the trouble with my account went out
to about half of the subscribers. To those who didn't receive it:

- If you have asked me questions, and didn't get any replies,
please mail me again.

- If you still haven't received issue #1, notify me.

Vidar Hokstad
Editor



-----------------------------------------------------------------------

BEGIN BREAKAWAY.002






B R E A K A W A Y

Debates on modern marxism


-+*+-


Issue no. 2, volume no. 1


June/July 1994





=======================================================================
CONTENTS
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

(00) EDITORIAL

(01) column: WHAT'S UP?
Some informal notes on issues we want to tell you about

(02) FIRST VICTIM OF THE REVOLUTION
Another poem...

(03) AUGUST MEETING
Red Forum needs a platform.

(04) column: A SEARCHLIGHT ON INTERNET
Revolutionary resources on the information highway

(05) column: READERS COMMENTS
got anything to say? do it here.

(06) series: FOR A NEW BEGINNING (1 of 2)
a critique of secterianism

(07) GENERAL INFORMATION
How and what to submit, how to contact us, etc.




=======================================================================
(00) EDITORIAL
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Finally. Summer's coming. At least it gets hotter in the air here
up north.

So. Time to liven up. But where are we heading? How will we work
to get a step or two closer towards our goals the last half of 1994?

For we can't just sit back and dream. Revolution won't grow on
dreams.

Submissions might be one way to do something. Because unity can
only be achieved if we know what other people think; if we know what
we think ourselves.

By submissions, I'm naturally fishing for articles for Breakaway,
but not only that. In general: Write, submit, make noise. If you write
well, even bourgeois papers might occasionally print. And when they
don't: Complain, call the editor, resubmit your piece to another,
more progressive newspaper and tell them who didn't want to print it,
and what excuse they gave.

It's worth a try. Even if the only result is that *one* reader
takes the trouble of learning more about socialism.

It's up to you. Overflow your local newspaper with articles and
comments. And if they don't publish, maybe we will...

Keep writing!


Vidar Hokstad
Editor


BTW: I may not have made this clear enough before, so I make sure
I do this time. The contents of this zine need not reflect the policy
of Red Forum, even when I it's written by me. Unless an expressivly
say so, the views presented are those of the author.



=======================================================================
(01) column: WHAT'S UP?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

- Thursday 20th May, a meeting in the executive committee of the
Norwegian Communist Party's (NKP) section in Oslo and Akershus
declared to be in favor of supporting a computer project suggested
by Red Forum / IC economically.

Suggested investments went up to 50.000 NOK (7500 USD), with
RF/IC paying an additional 4000 USD over a 5 year period,
allowing RF / IC to start it's own BBS with UUCP connection to
USENET, in addition to using the system for DTP.

Unfortunately, on a meeting the 15th of June, the final decision
were postponed until August. However, it is clear that RFIC will
probably set up a UUCP site whatever the NCP decides.

On the meeting on the 15th, critique against the project was
mainly directed towards the emphasis on information gathering
through electronic media, and the role of RFIC. An important
argument for the project is that the NCP will be unable to
provide the same facilities for producing it's party news-
paper without cooperation with RFIC.


- Breakaway #1 was advertized in three rounds in a series of USENET
conferences, and by June 28th, it had been distributed to
subscribers from USA, Canada, UK, Norway, Australia, France,
Spain, South-Africa, Ireland and Germany. I continued getting
responses to one of the posts for more than 6 weeks after it
was posted.


- Bourgeois censorship? The postal strike[1] in northern Germany
throughout this month was barely mentioned in Norwegian media. It
was if the whole thing wasn't happening, and our only source for
updated info turned out to be GermNews <germnews@vm.gmd.de> (news
from Germany in German, edited by some guy in Berlin).

But really, we should've expected this. Telling people about
the suggested "Postreform II", which in essence is the bourgeois
forces in the Bundestags attempt at selling the entire German
postal service to the highest-bidder, would certainly not
increase the popularity of the European Union which our social-
democratic government continues to insist is the best way to
secure social-democratic values (Notice that they stopped saying
"socialist values" about 15 years ago...).

Breakaway welcomes your comments on this and similar matters.
Do you find news on the net or elsewhere which is ignored by
bourgeoise newspapers and TV-stations? Tell us about it.


- Norwegians: In a short time, if everything turn out the way we
want to, we will be able to distribute selected articles from
"Friheten" through e-mail. Mail me if you want to subscribe.
This is meant to be the first step in providing material from
leftist newspapers through e-mail, and in a few weeks several
other revolutionary newspapers in Norway will receive the
same offer.

Be sure to specify whether you only want to receive the index
(to request selected articles later), or the full text.

We also welcome initiative from our subscribers when it
comes to providing material from newspapers outside Norway.


- Information about membership in Red Forum / IC can now
be obtained from me. Request the file info/Membership.


- Request submission guidelines by asking for the file
info/Submissions

----
[1] The German "postal" service includes the divisions "Postbank" and
"Telecom" in addition to mail delivery, and have about 670.000
employees.




=======================================================================
(02) FIRST VICTIM OF THE REVOLUTION
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

I saw a glimpse
of our future tonight.

Misery were thrown toward my eyes,
opression like today,
but most of all a spark
of hope.

In each and every
socalled "home"
man discussed his future.


Misery forced him

into action.


And as days went by in pain,
there were each and every day
another one
that whispered in the dark
a little,
long forgotten,
word.

But fear
it brought
when someone

in broad daylight

stood up straight and
dared to scream

- Revolution

and was shot.




=======================================================================
(03) AUGUST MEETING
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

It is quite some time since Red Forum was formed, and it was
decided to prepare a basic platform. Not much have been done, and now
summer's threatening :-) Meetings close to summer vacation have to
many times proved _impossible_... So, final decision concerning our
platform have been postponed until August.

But that does not mean that we won't do any work before that.
Presented here are some of the results of what have been done, with
explanations of the circumstances under which it has been done.

We hereby invite all RF / IC members, as well as Breakaway readers,
and others, to send us comments, alternative platforms (or just the
platform of _your_ favorite organization), criticism etc. We promise
that any input will be discussed at our meeting (unless we are drowning
in documents...), and at least an extensive summary of what we receive
will be published in Breakaway.

Since we plan to include as much as possible in Breakaway, and
to make as much of what we can't include in Breakaway publicly
accessibly by other means (from this autumn hopefully a series of
listserv / mailserver services), to as wide a public as possible,
we would prefer to receive documents in English, but if a) you have
printed documents you think would be of interest, or b) you feel
unable to express your ideas clear enough in English, we will at least
read, and quite possibly also translate, documents received in French,
German, Norwegian, Swedish and Danish.

Vidar Hokstad <vidarh@powertech.no>
Red Forum / Internationalists Committee


PS: Unfortunately, it has during my work on issue #2 of Breakaway
become clear that the person that were supposed to provide us with a
draft for discussion haven't been able to do so in time. The
mauscript, or another draft, will therefore make it to Breakaway at
earliest in time for Breakaway #3.

Because of this, this section may seems a litle strange. It was
meant to include the draft, in addition to two or three other short
pieces with comments, which all have been left out.




VIDAR HOKSTAD: On the "Oslo meeting" in February
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

It was still winter, and cold. Colder than the last years. The
streets were filled with snow, and walking out of the train station, I
think we all wished we'd lived somewhere warmer.

We were fewer than expected as we reached the offices of the
Norwegian Communist Party, where our meeting were to be held. Still
the meeting was attended by members from a broad range of
organisations.

The agenda of the meeting was nothing less than to form a new
revolutionary organisation. It wasn't a new party we wanted to build,
but an organisation that could try to unify through open debate, and
to spread information about marxism to new people, outside our
movement, and especially youth.

As in many other industrialized countries, the revolutionary left
have since long been dying in Norway. After the maoist movement stopped
attracting new youth in the middle of the seventies, almost no more
members came, and the old ones literally started dying.

However, with Gorbachev, new hopes strated growing. Even though
many of us, looking back, believe that Gorbachev was a lousy leader,
he should still be admired for freeing the revolutionary movement of
the curse which the Soviet union, and the "socialist" countries in
eastern Europe have been.

Finally it was possible for us to talk freely about the sacred
dogmas, the fanatical love directed towards the October revolution
1917, the admiration of Stalin because of his warfare against Hitler
(how could he not fight Hitler, a man who treatened his reign, a
competitor for the "crown"?), without being insulted; being called
petty-bourgeois, traitor, or "worse": Trotskyite.[1]

The main part of our meeting consisted of avoiding "difficult"
matters. Red Forum was never meant to be an organisation with views
about everything - the different parties and groups have thos views.
Too many of them. We wanted an organisation open to everyone,
everywhere, that accepts a basic platform, that consider themselves
marxists and revolutionaries, that are consequent internationalists.

The firm programme, the strong party line, is not something that
can be voted on by a small group. The revolutionary party, in my
opinion an international party, can only be formed by uniting the
existing movement, by bringing at least the majority of existing
groups and tendencies together.

It will take years, but continuous debates internally in the
movement will sooner or later bring the unity that is neccesary;
an unity that will be forced upon us as the threat from capitalist
regimes in crisis, scared capitalists, grow stronger.

One of the results of these principles were that we decided to
wait before creating a thorough program. We agreed that instead,
for a few months, giving us time to discuss, and to bring more
people into the forum, the following would do:

- Red Forum is a forum for the discussion of Marxist theory and
politics based on a revolutionary, internationlist foundation.

This is the foundation on which we invite new people to join
Red Forum / IC (so let me se some new members now ;), and which
provide a minimal basis for the work we have started doing. It is
not a foundation that can give us easy solutions to the daily
political struggle, but for this we have our respective parties.

It is a foundation which we hope will bring together, at first,
a small, geographically and politically, widespread group of people
to discuss new ways for the Marxist movement to escape from the
secterianism that have polluted the left for decades.

Applications for membership are encouraged. No fees are charged
at present, but expect this to change after the August meeting.

V.H.

----
[1] But secteric organisations still claim to be a guiding light for us
all here too. It's less than a month ago a member of "the ML group
Revolution" published an article covering an entire A3 page in the NCP
party newspaper, trying to insult me by calling me a "pettybourgeois
trotskyite" after I had criticized Stalin in the same newspaper on the
1st of May.



=======================================================================
(04) column: A SEARCHLIGHT ON INTERNET
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

* Pathfinder Press

GOPHER: ftp.std.com in '/Book Sellers'

Pathfinder Press specializes in publishing revolutionary and
working-class leaders in their own words, including Malcolm X, Nelson
Mandela, Che Guevara, Fidel Castro, Karl Marx and Frederick Engels.

It should be noted that Pathfinder is closely related to Militant
if I'm not mistaken...


* Book Stacks Unlimited Inc.

TELNET: books.com

Even though they're certainly not "progressive", it is possible
to find quite a lot of books by leftist writers among their 270.000
titles, even Marx. From my position, with the prices of books here
in Norway, it seemed cheap.


* Agora BBS

TELNET: agora.stm.it

BBS of the Italian Radical party, supporting 7 different languages.
(English, French, German, Italian, Esperanto, Russian and Spanish If
I remember correcly, It's a long time since I tested it). Even though
the interface is cumbersome, the system might contain some useful
information.



=======================================================================
(05) READERS COMMENTS
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Notice that I will not usually reply to critique on political
issues in the same issue as the letter is published. Replies will be
published at _earliest_ the issue after the letter, however admin-
istrative questions and comments, as well as direct questions to me
will be answered at once.

Also, when you write to me, please state clearly whether your
comment is a submission or not. If you don't, don't blame me if I
don't treat them as you intended.

Ed.


----
To: Vidar
From: Jack Hill <mlbooks@mercury.mcs.com>

Dear Vidar,

I still haven't had time to work up any real thorough critique of the
first issue of Breakaway. However, I do have a few thoughts and
comments that I would like to share with you.

Let me say first of all that roughly speaking I agree with your
analysis of what is the situation facing Marxist theory and those who
want to apply it to the current political and economic struggles. What
I mean is that we agree that Marxism is essential for the liberation of
the working class and all the oppressed; that it has been trampled on,
distorted, and mutilated by a wide variety of forces who claimed to be
communists; that we face a huge struggle to restore the good name of
communism.

One place where I think we don't see completely eye to eye, is in how
to characterize the regimes in Russia, Eastern Europe, China and
elsewhere which abandoned Marxism (or in some cases, never followed
it). You seem to want to call all these bureaucratic regimes
"Stalinist". I'm not sure that is an adequate characterization. I do
think they were all state capitalist regimes, but they varied quite a
bit among themselves in terms of how they came to power, how they
maintained it, to what extent they had popular support. Maoism is a
revisionist theory but it is not the same as Stalinism. There are a
lot of varieties of revisionism in the world and we have to look at all
of them carefully. Another related point is that I think the evidence
is clear that the Chinese revolution in particular produced substantial
advances for the Chinese masses. In other words I think the Chinese
revolution was a genuine popular revolution although the party which
led it was not a proletarian Marxist-Leninist party. So that when we
denounce Maoism, we are not denouncing the epic revolutionary struggle
of the Chinese people.

Anyway, there is a lot of theoretical sorting out to do get rid of the
mountains of historical garbage and re-establish a genuine, scientific
and revolutionary Marxist theory. The Marxist-Leninist Party, in my
opinion, did some very good historical research into some of these
questions, but there are a lot more questions yet to be cleared up. As
one example, comrades in Chicago did very extensive research into the
women's movement and the struggles for women's liberation in early
Soviet Russia. We will be publishing a book bringing together our
articles and research in the next couple of months.

There is a lot more to be said on this but I don't have time right now.

I have a couple other less political comments. Personally I didn't
care much for the poem you published. I prefer literature which more
directly attacks the "system" in one way or another. Have you heard of
Struggle magazine? I'll send you a copy in the mail. The editor and I
have been politically associated for over 25 years.

The other point is not major and I'm not sure if I should ever mention
it but I will. I don't want to sound too harsh or overly critical, but
my point is that there were some spots in that first issue where the
English could have been improved. All your main points came through
clearly enough, so I don't want to make too big a deal out of this.
But for maximum clarity, it could probably use a little more work.

So, good job! Hang in there. I'm looking forward to the next issue.

While I'm at it I will send you a couple other things that I didn't
send you before. There is a May First leaflet we put out, an exchange
I had on PNEWS Conferences about the dissolution of the MLP, and the
editorial of Struggle magazine which I posted to PNEWS.

Keep up the struggle,
Jack Hill

----
Editors comments:

- When it comes to fiction, we'll probably annoy quite a few of you,
because a lot of what we publish will be experimental in a lot of ways,
and very much of it related to Cyberpunk. The reason? The taste of
the editor, and the people I relate to, and "steal" material from.
The only way to change this is by actually submitting...

So: All of you that write fiction, submit. That's the only way of
increasing the diversity of this zine.

- When it comes to improving grammar and style, please feel free to
comment. Especially help on which terms to use etc. will be
appreciated, as translating texts on politics in general, and marxism
in particular, demands quite a lot of terms that certainly can't be
translated directly, and were it often is little help in a dictionary.

The problem is certainly not reduced by the fact that we have to
rely on translations done entirely by people with English as their
second language.

If anyone feel they can contribute: I would be extremely grateful
if someone offers to read through material to check the language every
now and then, or, even better, volunteer to help translating when (if)
we get hold of material in languages you master.


Apart from that? Well, I _will_ give my views with regards to Jack's
other comments in the next issue, so watch out... ;)



=======================================================================
(06) FOR A NEW BEGINNING (1 of 2)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

I received the following article from Dave Hollis some time ago, and
even though the article is quite long, I decided to edit it only
slightly. The unedited text is available on request. To let Dave
himself tell you about the background (quoted from the message he
sent me):

" The following article was written by myself for a conference of
people who came out of a trotskyist organisation. Over 1.5 years ago I
did so myself. The article is an attempt to elaborate experiences made
in German and the UK on the questions of sectarianism and democratic
centralism. "




FOR A NEW BEGINNING

Written by Dave Hollis <ln_dho@pki-nbg.philips.de>
Co-authored by Maggie McQuillan
Please contact the author before republishing the article.



It is lamentable that he [Ted Grant] has allowed his political
authority to be used by people whose main concern is not to
clarify ideas but to cause the maximum damage to Militant.
One unfortunate feature of political life is the spiteful urge
of former activists to justify their defection by hurling
allegations of heinous political crimes at their former
comrades.
(Militant, 24/1/1992)

The action to spread these lies outside the organisation, is a
despicable attempt to sabotage our work, which arises from
pure spite ...
(A Reply to PBy, RWe, JG)




The current developments in England come as no surprise to us. The
decision we took to leave over a year and a half ago was based on the
understanding that the new organisation was not fundamentally different
from the old one. We realised and said then that it was only a
question of time until a new split would take place. The formation of
the "Democratic Platform" days after the world conference was only an
harbinger of the events that were to follow.

I have avoided commenting up to now on the events taking place in the
"Socialist Appeal". Although a pamphlet was dedicated to us and we
were used as a stick to beat the "Democratic Platform" with, I chose to
remain silent. It was not a case of being unable to answer the
accusations and the points made, it was quite simply that I, and
others, had put this sect behind us.

Given that a discussion is now beginning to take place on how one
should go forward, I feel that the time is now appropriate to comment
on the current events, relate our experiences and put forward what I
consider has to be done. I recommend all Comrades to read the document
Bruno wrote shortly after we left, "How and what must be Discussed".
It contains a concise explanation of the state of thinking in Germany
at that time and what we considered to be the next steps.

Before I go into details, I would like to put the question of Pat's
role in Germany straight. Despite what the leaders of sect number two
think or want to believe, there was no secret activity between the
"Democratic Platform" and the German group. There was no one pulling
our strings. In addition, anyone with a degree of political
understanding could have seen that there were (and most probably are) a
number of political disagreements between us.

An author is often betrayed by the language used when writing or
speaking. This is very much case in the article "answering" Pat,
Julian and Roy. For instance, why does the second sect talk about a
"conspiracy"? Why do comrades act "in spite", and so on? It is
necessary to look into the reasons why people react in such a way. For
instance, why do members of such an organisation view those who leave
as "betrayers" who, to add insult to injury, are also considered to be
acting "in spite"?

The answer to these questions lies in understanding that we are dealing
here with a typical behaviour of a sect.



SECTS

One thing that strikes me when thinking back to the definition of a
sect in the Militant and Socialist Appeal, is the fact that a sect is
defined by its inability to build a mass base. At best, this
definition is only half the truth and at worse, it is totally false.

What characterises a sect is not its inability to build but its
internal workings - how the members relate to each other, how they
react to "outsiders", etc. A sect is a group of people who follow a
particular teaching and consider every other teaching to be wrong and
dangerous. To put it another way: a sect is the belief of a group of
people that their "model" of how society is to be interpreted is the
one and only truth.

This definition does not quite capture the real nature of a sect. What
is also important is that psychological factors play the main role. A
sect is held together by beliefs. Either you accept them and you are a
member, otherwise you have no place within it. The loyalty to the
organisation is not based on a conscious understanding of its aims, it
is loyalty to the group. The members "function", they mostly do not
act consciously. The smaller the organisation the greater the part
played by psychological factors. It is no accident that such
organisations have their idols and "great leaders". It is also no
accident that the feeling of "us" and "them" was nurtured in Militant
and Socialist Appeal. The "family feeling" is a prerequisite for the
functioning of a sect.

The Jehovah Witnesses have their bible, a Marxist organisation has the
works of Marx, Engels, Lenin, Trotsky or whoever.

This way of thinking leads unavoidably its members to considering those
who disagree with their point of view to be "not loyal", "spiteful",
out to cause damage, etc. Those who become "dissidents" are countered
in the main by insults and not by arguments. For most of the members
of Militant it was only necessary to put us into a particular
compartment, accuse us of departing from Marxism and that was that -
and it worked! In both sects we experienced this, I don't think I have
to elaborate further.

One particular analogy that springs to mind is that of looking at
membership of a sect as being like a marriage. To leave a sect is like
getting divorced. It is neither easy, nor is it without pain.

As is the case with other subjects, there is still a lot that needs to
be written on this. In passing, I would just like to mention the
following aspects not discussed in this article: martyrdom, sacrifices
for the cause and assimilation. They are worth an article in
themselves. Unfortunately, time is pressing - I want to finish this
article before your conference and not afterwards. One of the most
painful but most interesting revelations for me was the discovery that
the workings of a political and a religious sect are more less
identical and that all "cadre" organisations I have met up to know
operate in the same way.

At first I found it hard to believe this. Since leaving the second
sect, however, I have spoken with a number of people who were also
members of "cadre" organisations and have found out that the behaviour
experienced was always strikingly similar.

I can imagine the howls of rage at such statements. I hope, however,
that no one was offended. Whoever feels offended should think over
very carefully why this is the case.

There are many obvious behaviours that indicate the presence of a
political sect. A few examples: The inability to think for oneself,
the repetition of the "line", blind loyalty, the inability to question
a point of view, the "functioning" of the members, the inability to
understand someone else's point of view.

Comrades who do not believe this should ask themselves a few questions:
Did not the old organisations talk about their faith in the working
class? What place does "faith" have for people who consider themselves
to be "Marxists"? Either we are talking about a science or we are
talking about a religion. It is necessary to decide which of the two
possibilities we want. Why does the resolution on the founding of the
new (old) International talk about being based on the first four
congresses of the Communist International? Is it not obvious to anyone
who claims to be a Marxist that resolutions passed over seventy years
ago are very unlikely to have any bearing on the economical and
political situation of today? The references to the writings of the
'great teachers' are just as bad.

In passing, the attempt by such organisations to justify their program
and actions by reference to such things or people is religious activity
at its purest.

As we only know too well (see the resolution on the founding of the
"International" passed at Tarrogona), an attempt is made to build a
line of tradition backwards to particular "gurus" or whatever. The
organisation stands at the front of this line as the natural
continuation of the best traditions of the past. However, it is
overseen that this is religion. Religion is re-ligio - a backwards
connection to a mystical beginning.

Once a political organisation has laid claim to this "revolutionary
continuity", the question of a programme's content is also solved.
Either the timeless validity of programmes out of the past are insisted
upon or parts of various programmes are eclectically thrown together.

I remember very clearly Ted not being happy with our idea in Germany of
writing a new political program, i.e. a manifesto. "What do you need
it for, you have the Transitional Programme" -as if the world had stood
still for the past fifty years! It is no wonder that in such
organisations practices characteristic of religious sects quickly
manifest themselves ...


...continued in Breakaway #3


=======================================================================
(07) GENERAL INFORMATION
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

A reduced "General Information" column from now on, not to use
all the space repeating the same info...

Breakaway will be published as often as we have enough material.
"Enough" is at present about 30kb of text, but this might increase
if we get enough submissions. Under any circumstances we'll limit
ourselves to 30kb until we reach one issue every two weeks. (Probably
won't happen in your lifetime ;-)

The format is, as you can see, pure 7-bit ASCII.


Do you:

- want to subscribe?
- have an idea?
- have a question?
- want to submit, and want to know how?


Just send us a message, preferably by e-mail, and we'll send you
appropriate information as soon as possible. To ensure that we can
reply, please include your e-mail address in the body of the message.



SOME BRIEF NOTES ON SUBMISSIONS
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

* BREAKAWAY will accept articles from people belonging to all trends
or ideologies related to marxism, or from people who are simply
interested in marxist theory or practice.

* You should limit yourself to articles between 100 and 300 lines if
possible (shorter pieces will naturally also be accepted). If you
find that difficult, try to divide your article into shorter
sections suitable for publishing over two to four issues.

* We will publish most articles or news reports we receive concerning
marxist ideology, the actions of marxist organisations, or
information of importance to the average revolutionary. Also
fiction might be accepted (contact us for more info)

* We accept anonymous submissions. However, if you choose to do so,
we would prefer if you give us a pseudonym to use as your
signature.



How to contact Red Forum / Internationalists Committee:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Editor : Vidar Hokstad
E-mail : <vidarh@powertech.no>
Snailmail : Boks 30, N-2001 Lillestroem, NORWAY
Tel. : +47 638 170 35 (5pm to 9pm GMT)

=======================================================================
Proletarians of all countries, unite!
=======================================================================

END BREAKAWAY.002

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الاسم : جابر حسين الناصح - السن :٤٢سنه - الموقف من التجنيد : ادي الخدمه - خبره عشرين سنه منهم عشر سنوات في كبرى الشركات بالسعوديه وعشر سنوات ...

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Lost Civilizations (@lostcivilizations)
6 Nov 2024
Thank you! I've corrected the date in the article. However, some websites list January 1980 as the date of death.

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@guest
5 Nov 2024
Crespi died i april 1982, not january 1980.

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@guest
4 Nov 2024
In 1955, the explorer Thor Heyerdahl managed to erect a Moai in eighteen days, with the help of twelve natives and using only logs and stone ...

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@guest
4 Nov 2024
For what unknown reason did our distant ancestors dot much of the surface of the then-known lands with those large stones? Why are such cons ...

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@guest
4 Nov 2024
The real pyramid mania exploded in 1830. A certain John Taylor, who had never visited them but relied on some measurements made by Colonel H ...

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@guest
4 Nov 2024
Even with all the modern technologies available to us, structures like the Great Pyramid of Cheops could only be built today with immense di ...
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