Copy Link
Add to Bookmark
Report
HOMEBREW Digest #2154
This file received at Hops.Stanford.EDU 1996/08/21 PDT
Homebrew Digest Wednesday, 21 August 1996 Number 2154
FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
Shawn Steele, Digest Janitor
Thanks to Rob Gardner for making the digest happen!
Contents:
COPS vs. Homebrewers! Watch Out! (Lee Bollard)
Lactose & Fruit Beers ((MR BILL STOUGHTON))
powdered amylase in mash (Steve Alexander)
Scientific Books on Brewing wanted - help (Steve Alexander)
Protein Suspension (Steve Alexander)
Botulism - infected grain. (Steve Alexander)
GABF A Financial Bust (Rob Moline)
Jet vs Ring (Kirk R Fleming)
SS kettles with valve (BAke)
Botulism (BOBKATPOND@aol.com)
Third try of admission.. reject or cancel? ((Waymon Witherspoon))
RE: Sticking to styles/Oktoberfest recipes ((George De Piro))
Re: Burners & Converted Kegs (RUSt1d?)
Starch balling? Not here! ("P.S. Edwards")
Shiner recipe (Dale Smith)
Re: doughing in and Starch balling (Don Trotter)
Announcing the Dayton Beerfest Competition (zabarnic@saber.udayton.edu)
Splitting kegged beer? (KRAUSG)
Dough in/Ofest (Jim Busch)
Re: Tollhouse Porter IBUs/OG; Shoulda brewed lagers ("Pat Babcock")
Thunder Mountain Brew-Off (Kirk Johnson)
For SUBMISSIONS to be published, send mail to:
homebrew@aob.org
For (UN)SUBSCRIBE requests, send mail to:
homebrew-digest-request@aob.org
and include ONLY subscribe or unsubscribe in the BODY of the message.
Please note that if subscribed via BEER-L, you must unsubscribe by sending
a one line e-mail to listserv@ua1vm.ua.edu that says: UNSUB BEER-L
If your address is changing, please unsubscribe from the old address and
then subscribe from the new address.
If your account is being deleted, please be courteous and unsubscribe first.
For technical problems send e-mail to the Digest Janitor, shawn@aob.org.
OTHER HOMEBREW INFORMATION
http://www.aob.org/aob - The AHA's web site.
http://alpha.rollanet.org - "The Brewery" and the Cat's Meow Archives.
info@aob.org - automated e-mail homebrewing information.
ARCHIVES:
At ftp.stanford.edu in /pub/clubs/homebrew/beer via anonymous ftp. Also
http://alpha.rollanet.org on the web and at majordomo@aob.org by e-mail.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Lee Bollard <leeb@iea.com>
Date: Tue, 20 Aug 1996 18:10:15 -0700
Subject: COPS vs. Homebrewers! Watch Out!
> and to top it all off, the camera panned in on a copy
> of Papizian's _New Complete Joy of Hombrewing_!!!!!!! I couldn't believe my
> eyes!
I also saw this episode of COPS some time ago. Unbelievable! Everything
that Eric said about that program is true. Scary actually. I think the
arrest took place in Tacoma, Washington.
The "perpetrator" had committed a crime, his small marijuana plants
growing in the closet... but all the discussion was about his so-called
STILL! People could get the wrong idea after watching this episode then
seeing the gear we beer-brewers use in every-day brewing!
The funniest part was the shot of TNCJOHB... incredible...
- --
- -------- Lee Bollard leeb@iea.com --------
------------------------------
From: ZXRF66A@prodigy.com (MR BILL STOUGHTON)
Date: Tue, 20 Aug 1996 21:19:03, -0500
Subject: Lactose & Fruit Beers
- -- [ From: Bill Stoughton * EMC.Ver #2.10P ] --
Al wrote:
> Milk sugar (lactose) is not fermentable and will not make your beer
> thinner. It will make it sweeter and thicker.
During the recent discussions on adding fruit it was mentioned that
residual sweetness was desirable in a fruit beer to accentuate the
fruit flavor, and that the addition of crystal malt would supply this
sweetness. Could lactose also be used to increase sweetness, and thus
improve the fruit character? If so, at what stage should it be added
to the brewing process?
Bill Stoughton ZXRF66A@prodigy.com
------------------------------
From: Steve Alexander <stevea@clv.mcd.mot.com>
Date: Tue, 20 Aug 1996 22:10:09 -0400
Subject: powdered amylase in mash
Keith Royster writes ...
>Also, nobody responded to my recent question regarding the pros/cons
>of adding amylase in powdered form to my mash. I assume that it
>won't really make much difference on well modified malts with strong
>enzyme concentrations, but what about other grains such as wheat?
I've seen analyses of wheat malt that show higher diastatic power than
typical pale barley malt. Perhaps you were referring to unmalted
wheat. Generally unmalted grains can contribute a fair bit of
beta-amyalse to a mash, but no alpha-amylase.
I have seen graphs from commercial enzyme producers indicating higher
fermentability from pale malt by adding either extra BA or AA enzyme.
YMMV. This *WAS* from an enzyme vendor. Take it with a grain of salt.
The graph showed fermentability rising to around 90% apparent
attenuation with big additions of AA !!
Powdered alpha-amylase will have decidedly different temperature
characteristics than barley AA. As I recall fungal source amylases
have lower temperature stability and bacterial source AA has
significantly higher temperature stability (might be the other way
around) and the differences are significant.
Also amylases from various sources produce somewhat different amounts of
various sugars and dexrtins. For example Barley BA does a poor job of
breaking malto-triose into maltose + a glucose. BA from some other
sources do a much better job of this. It's called enzyme specificity -
enzymes of the same general class preferentially cataylse different
reactions differently. I've seen some data in Gerald Reeds book that
indicates that AA from different sources produce quite different
amounts of the various dextrins. This can obviously affect flavor
fermentability and body.
>Will it throw my enzyme concentrations (alpha VS beta) out of whack?
>I find it hard to beleive that nobody had an opinion on it, so I'm
>assuming it was missed during the HBD mailer problems a few weeks
>ago. If anyone does have any thoughts on the matter, I'd love to
>hear them. TIA!
Some graphs I've been closely studying from M&B Sci (fig 9.13 I
believe) lead me to think that as the BA to AA ratio of a mash drops,
the fermentability drops only slowly until the BA:AA ratio gets down
to around 2:1. As the ratio drops further the fermentability drops
much more quickly. I believe that this graph was made with constant
amount of AA and declining amounts of BA. BTW - pale malt has a BA:AA
ratio around 6:1, pale-ale malt, kilned at a high temp has a BA:AA
ratio around 4:1. Raw grain adjuncts may contribute as much as 40% of
their 'malted form' beta-amylase activity.
The question is *WHY* do you want to add foreign amylases to your mash?
If you are using a high concentration of unmalted grain, like barley,
wheat, rye, sorghum or triticale, then you should expect the BA
content to be low but probably no less than 30 or 40% of normal, and
the AA content of the raw grain will be zero. Adding extra AA might
make sense in this case, because the mash time required would be quite
long since you rely only on AA from a small pale barley malt addition.
You should eventually end up with wort of normal fermentability I
believe.
Of course if you are trying to mash some other non-grain starch then
all bets are off regarding enzyme content.
If you are trying to get maximal fermentability then extra AA would
also be useful, but the resulting beer may not be very desireable. The
unfermentable content of beer provides a lot of the body and possibly
some flavor.
If maximal fermentability is the key (flavor be damned) then follow
the whiskey distillers method. Even with very high adjunct load
whiskey manufacturers bring the very thin mash up to ~50C or 55C and
then allow the mash to cool to pitching temperatures. They then pitch
right into the mash - grist and all with a highly attenuative strain
of yeast/lactobacteria or both. The mash/beer/wort (?) continues to
enzymatically produce new fermentables even as it ferments.
Conclusion:
Generally speaking I personally wouldn't bother with non-grain
amylases when making high quality beer unless you anticipate a serious
mashing problem that would severely limit fermentability. The
resulting wort when using foreign amylases will have different spectum
of sugars and dextrins and this shift will certainly have repercussion
in the resulting beer's body, possibly flavor, and even in the amount
and types of yeast metabolic by-products (fusel alcohols, esters,
VDKs).
Experiment please, but be aware that it will take a lot of trial and
error or research to learn to use these amylases in producing 'great
beer'.
Steve Alexander
------------------------------
From: Steve Alexander <stevea@clv.mcd.mot.com>
Date: Tue, 20 Aug 1996 22:21:18 -0400
Subject: Scientific Books on Brewing wanted - help
Does anyone have an opinion on 'Brewing Science' from Academic Press,
by Pollack(sp?). Academic press has many fine books in their food
science series, but I'm not anxious to part with $150 buck unless this
is a *great* book.
I also came across a reference to volume 4 of a multi-volume book
called "Brewing Science and Technology" in a 1995 Journal of the
Institute of Brewing (a british journal). I have no publisher or
author or other info. It's probably british and probably fairly
recent. It was referenced in several places in an article discussing
answers to the most recent Master Brewers examination - (which BTW
looks like a pretty tough test). Basically it looks like this book
set contains many of the answers. Does anyone have info on this one ?
Other books ? "Malting and Brewing Science" is well known with a
second edition around 1981. Is anyone aware of better newer books
along this line ?
Steve Alexander
------------------------------
From: Steve Alexander <stevea@clv.mcd.mot.com>
Date: Tue, 20 Aug 1996 22:52:27 -0400
Subject: Protein Suspension
Karel J. Chaloupka writes ...
>I just brewed an Octoberfest beer yesterday and got a lot of protein
>suspension. I used around 9 lbs of Pilsnet Malt & 1.5 lbs of assorted
>crystal malts. I mash in at 158F and sparged at 172F. I also used irish moss
>at the end of the boil. I've never really have had this problem before. Any
>suggestions on why this happened?
With such a high initial temperature you could potentially not have
degraded the proteins sufficiently. The other possibility is that at
this very high saccharification temp, you got incomplete conversion
as your enzymes went kaput - and now you have starch in suspension.
Hard to say - but I'd guess starch if you haven't been having problems
with this pilsner malt above in say other 149F to 158F infusion mashes.
(where there isn't much protein breakdown either).
Since you haven't had problems before and you have in all probability
used these malts before - look at your brewing notes and see what is
different. My guess is that mash temperature and time varied from
your typical mash - No ? These are the culprits.
BTW - I've just read an article indicating that irish moss is
virtually useless at pH values below around 5.3. You may want to
check wort pH from the boiler before deciding whether to bother with
the irish moss.
The other possibility is that Mars, the god of war and october is
punishing you for not using any Vienna or Munich malt in your
'octoberfest' beer. What *were* you thinking about Karel ?
Steve Alexander
------------------------------
From: Steve Alexander <stevea@clv.mcd.mot.com>
Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 00:41:21 -0400
Subject: Botulism - infected grain.
Mark Marsula writes ...
>Botulinum bacteria will not be destroyed by boiling! Botulinum spores
>become active in low-acid, oxygen-free conditions and produce a toxin that
>causes botulism poisoning which can be fatal. Pressure cookers are used
>in home canning to reach a tempurature of 240F for that reason. A high pH
>(2 - 3.5) will also prevent botulinum spores from becoming active.
Uhh well - I don't want to re-ignite the sanitize sterilize debate,
but boiling will drastically reduce the number of viable botilinum -
but may not be sufficient to prevent an infection in canned goods
stored for many months. There are some nice curves in M&B Sci I
believe showing viable cells on a temperature time graph. Any book on
food processing/infection issues shows the same graph. An hour boil
should knock out virtually every cell - but viable spores may remain
unless you use a pressure cooker. I don't think we care about the
spores, we don't even care if a few cells survive in wort.
Eating or drinking botulism cells or spores isn't dangerous, but the
toxin they produce is extremely dangerous, potent and deadly. The
toxin is rendered harmless well below the boiling point.
I don't know where Mark got the pH 2 to 3.5 figure, but this is far
more acid than many of the canned fruits which do not require the
pressure cooking canning techniques. BTW fermented beer has a pH
down near the 3.5 figure - far too low for the spores to get a start.
Another point - botulism live primarily off of protein, not
carbohydrates. They used to historically be a big problem in canned
meats which have plenty of protein and low acidity.
Botulism is a very common organism in soil. If wort could support
botulism colonies, we'd certainly have heard of homebrewing deaths
from botulism by now. HB wort is certainly infected by every other
microbe in town - from my reading of HBD.
My conclusion is that the probability of getting botulism poisoning by
drinking beer from infected grain is essentially zero. On the other
hand there are some Ergot grain funguses that produce LSD like
by-products (which some HBDers might actually prefer). There is also
one grain fungus which seems to produce a carcinogenic by-product,
which causes pancreatic cancer - usually quite deadly. These are
probably both harmless after the boil but I wouldn't count on it.
Particularly the carcinogenic possibility.
I agree with other posters - forget the infected grain for flavor
reasons at least.
Steve Alexander
------------------------------
From: Rob Moline <brewer@kansas.net>
Date: Tue, 20 Aug 1996 22:54:44 -0500
Subject: GABF A Financial Bust
The Jethro Gump Report
Trying to do some catching up, but saw the stuff on the GABF. I know for a
fact that the GABF is a financial loser for the last 2 years. I believe this
has to do with the costs associated with renting Currigan Hall, but as a
brewer, the cost to send one beer to the GABF in '94 was 55 bucks, '95 was
65 bucks, and this year it's 105 for a regular slot and 125 for one of the
special anniversary slots.
I am in the process of moving my office back home, (gotta be
prepared, ya know!), so am unable to locate the exact figures, but will
vouch for the fact that they don't make a heap on the deal.
Cheers!
Jethro
Cheers!
Rob Moline
Little Apple Brewing Company
Manhattan, Kansas
"The more I know about beer, the more I realize I need to know more about
beer!"
------------------------------
From: Kirk R Fleming <flemingk@usa.net>
Date: Tue, 20 Aug 1996 22:15:07 +0100
Subject: Jet vs Ring
In #2153 "Gregory, Guy J." <GGRE461@ecy.wa.gov> responded to Chuck and
Grace Burkins <burkins@oa.net> who asks:
> Whats your impression of the jet style King Kooker burners?
I made two jet burners using 6" long water pipe nipples (1 1/2" NPT, I think)
and they have the advantages of being easy to make, and very cheap to make if
you're using natural gas.
> Has anyone doing all grain actually scorched some wort, or is that a
> momism? I was sent the jet style in error, (miscommunication
Well, if anyone says "Jet burners scorch the wort" that's a generalization. As
with many generalizations, it's definitely true in specific cases, but not
generally so. With 50 or so batches, I've scorched once, and it was very minor
and it was in the mash tun, not the kettle.
> My guess is that the radial style is more efficient
*This* may be a momism. I don't know, but I think jet burners are real gas
hogs. Maybe BTU per cu ft of gas is worse, or maybe they simply deliver
energy to the the pot less efficiently, can't say.
> gives better control.
Well, that's pretty much true, except you *can* turn jet burners down pretty
low
but then it's pretty clear they aren't burning too efficiently.
>...the single jet seems to work just fine for me. And, it sounds like an F-15.
More like an F-4, I think.
> Temp raising for mashing control I accomplish by removing the mashtun from
> the heat altogether....my brewpartner does the same with his ring burner.
I burn wide open (MIL Thrust) for 60 seconds, which raises the mash temp very
close to 1F, then reduce the recirc rate to minimum for the next 8-10 minutes,
during which time the mash temp drops by 1F, then repeat. Perfectly observable,
controllable, and repeatable. This could be automated with a residential
furnace gas valve controlled electronically, but I haven't done it yet.
I was told by someone here that Metal Fusion, the company that makes the ring
burners for one of the Cajun Cooker type burners, sells the ring burner
assembly for $15. I think this is the way to go if you don't need the stand.
KRF Colorado Springs
------------------------------
From: BAke <bakesbit@aol.com>
Date: Tue, 20 Aug 1996 23:02:43 -0700
Subject: SS kettles with valve
The kettles at Liberty are imported from a company called Marchisio
in Italy by a company called Brewmaster in California and resold to
homebrew shops around the country with a 100% markup!!! These "pots"
come in many sizes (up to 1600 litre/ over 400 gal) in Italy but only
the 30, 50, and 100 litre versions are brought here. The "pots" are
actually olive oil vats that were NOT intended for boiling but rather
for bulk olive oil storage. The Italian company makes a stand for them
so that once filled they are high enough to hold a container under the
tap,this is why there are no handles since they weren't meant to be
moved.
The pot is 304 stainless but the valve is nickel plated plain steel
which will rust with time. Your best bet is to buy a nickel plated brass
or better a stainless valve and a short 2 in. or so threaded piece of SS
pipe to replace the original valve. That way you have a true taper fit
that won't leak and won't corrode on you either. Also be careful of the
welded seam up the side and around the bottom, watching for cracks,
especially where heat gets near it at the bottom.
Good luck with yours!
------------------------------
From: BOBKATPOND@aol.com
Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 08:00:07 -0400
Subject: Botulism
There are two problems with botulism, the spores and the toxin. The spores at
stable at 100C for several hours. They are killed by moist heat at 120C in
30 minutes. The toxin is what kills you and it is destroyed by 80C in 30
minutes. (From Princlples of Internal Medicine text).
I doubt that a puffy bag of malt has any botulism in it. If it does that
plant that produced it has major problems because all their malt is probably
infected. The most likely explaination is wild yeast. If it was free use it
and see what happens, the taste will tell.
Bob Morris
------------------------------
From: mwithers@atc.boeing.com (Waymon Witherspoon)
Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 05:05:38 -0700
Subject: Third try of admission.. reject or cancel?
I sent this in last week and the week before but it has not appeared. I
am using my alternate mail address to see what is going on. If this does
not appear, I will be canceling out due to CENSORSHIP...
____________________________________________________________________________
I sent this in earlier this week but it has not appeared. Is this
too far off toipic that i get <CANCELED> or what? Because I brew
beer, wine, mead and megathins this is not off topic to me..
- -------------------------------------------------------
Ok, about 2/3rd of my hop crop is in. The last batch I made
the mistake of putting them in the oven to dry. The oven is
an old style (with pilot) for about 2.5 hrs at low heat. Talk
about crispy dry. They smelled very grassy/citrusy (I have Cascade
growing). Next time, back to the Attic with tme. So far picked
4.5 OZ.
Next............. I need a wine pres. Anyone in the So. Jersey
/Piladelphia area have an old one to get rid of? I cannot afford
a new one. Even if someone has turned it into a planter and
the wood is rotting out, I can fix that. Email or post here to
tell me...
Thanks
Mark Witherspoon
witherspoonm@pgate.he.boeing.com
mwithers@atc.boeing.com
"Re-engineering is like performing an apendectomy on yourself. Your chances of
survival are slim and it really hurts, but you gain the confidence to go after
something bigger next time ... like that red pumping thing." - Scott Adams
------------------------------
From: George_De_Piro@berlex.com (George De Piro)
Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 08:29:52 -0700
Subject: RE: Sticking to styles/Oktoberfest recipes
Jim Dunlap writes about U.S. micros not sticking to style guidelines.
Well, it's easy for them to do that because the majority of people
here (U.S.) don't know the styles.
He complains about American HefeWeizen, especially. The single
biggest reason that they lack the character of a true Bavarian Weizen
is the yeast strain. Wheat, to my palate, does little more than
lighten the taste of beer. The yeast used in Bavaria adds all the
distinctive flavors you love: clove, banana, vanilla, etc.
Bavarian HefeWeizen can be just as cloudy as American versions.
Paulaner from a keg, or with the sediment from a bottle poured into
the glass, is quite cloudy. Part of the reason it may be a bit less
cloudy than it's American counterparts is because it is filtered to
remove the unique, poorly flocculating Weizen yeast. A highly
flocculent lager yeast is then added for bottle conditioning.
In Germany consumers are much more educated about the beer they drink.
If a beer is labeled "HefeWeizen," they expect a beer of at least 50%
wheat malt with yeast in the bottle and the characteristic
banana/clove flavors.
I think it's cool that American brewers are creating some novel styles
by broadly interpreting the classics, but they shouldn't label them in
such a way that consumers are confused. I personally stay away from
ALL American wheat beers because the majority are as interesting as
Miller (yes, I've had a FEW that are interesting, but too few)!
Alt beer? How many Americans even have an idea of what this is, much
less had a real one!
Jim is correct in saying that only education of consumers will change
this.
------------------
About Oktoberfest formulations, the Fix book is confusing to me, also.
Perhaps it is out-of-date in it's assessment of the availability of
high quality Munich malt. I don't see how one can obtain the proper
toasty character without Munich malt. Crystal malts are going to give
the beer a Scotch ale like caramel quality.
In his book he stresses that the recipes were tried in contests and
adjusted according to the results. After tasting the Oktoberfest
beers that were contending for the semifinal round of the BBC World
homebrew contest, I realized that just because a beer wins doesn't
mean it's right!
My own Marzen was NOT toasty enough for my palate, nor did it
attenuate as much as I would have liked. My guess is that it was
closer to style then the other competitors, and there were COMPETENT
judges who knew this (not always the case, especially at regional
comps. Case in point: Milo-Marzen #2 scored a 22 at a contest just
weeks before winning the Nationals!).
If you have a good palate it is best to judge your creations against
the world classics, and take judges opinions with a grain of salt,
even when they LIKE your beer!
By the way, perhaps Jim just typed his thought backwards, but I think
that you need a lot of Munich malt in the grain bill to achieve the
proper character, and little or no crystal.
Sorry if this turned preachy!
George De Piro (Nyack, NY)
------------------------------
From: RUSt1d? <rust1d@li.com>
Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 09:26:32 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: Burners & Converted Kegs
>Does anyone know a SIMPLE way to make
>this work, or should I go with the 160K - 200K jet type burners that
>have a wider base for the kegs to sit on?
How about one of those 4 way tire irons? It could be wired to the top
of the burner. You know the kind I mean, shaped like a plus sign with
four different size sockets...
>I was also looking at the
>false bottom/drain setup by Stainless in Seattle advertised in BT.
>Does anyone have any experience with these? Are they worth the
>money? All opinions are welcome, public or private.
I would also like to know of other sources of false bottoms. Send
addresses/phone numbers to me please. Kirk, could you send Stainless'?
John Varady
Boneyard Brewing Co.
"Ale today, Gone tomorrow"
------------------------------
From: "P.S. Edwards" <pedwards@iquest.net>
Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 08:49:02 -0500
Subject: Starch balling? Not here!
Al writes:
>The other reason that we would prefer to not add the malt to the hot
>liquor is because of the enzymes. Let's say you are starting with 180F
>water and plan to hit a target temp of 158F. You add a pound of malt
>to 10 quarts of hot water. Stir till most of the clumps break up. Now
>the water (and all the enzymes from that first pound of grist) are at,
>say 176F. You add another pound, stir; temp is 174F... Only when you >add the
final pound and stir will you reach 158F.
Wow, you start w/ 180 deg water? In my Gott cooler, to hit a 158 deg
mash temp with 20 lbs of grain and 20 qts mash water, I only need 174
deg water.
I'm an advocate of adding grain to mash water for the same reason Jim
Busch states: easier to measure the mash water in my mash-tun (a
10-gallon Gott cooler with copper tube manifold). I heat all my mash &
sparge water in an insulated & electrically heated 1/2 bbl keg, and I
usually have put in more water than I think I'll need. To see how much
I've drained out if I were to add water to grist would require me to
either add a flowmeter in line with the drain or add a calibrated sight
tube to the tank. Call me lazy. Night before I brew, I fill the tank,
plug the heating element into a heavy-duty 110 VAC timer, and set it to
come on about 4 am. When I get down to the brewery the next morning at
about 7:30 or 8:00, I've got 14 gallons of approximately 180 deg water
ready to go. (My add'l approx 2 gallons of mash-out water is boiled in
a stockpot on my burner while the mash is progressing)
I pre-heat the tun by adding the mash water at 180 (+/-) deg F and then
let it cool to my target temp, then mix in grain.
I add about 1/2 or 3/4 of the grain, stir (using a long-handled
restaurant sized potato masher as a rake), then add the rest of the
grain. The potato masher is lifted up & down in the mash as I go to
break up any clumps. No problemo. I used to do the iodine test for
conversion, but since my mashes never fail to convert, I stopped.
Starch haze hasn't ever been a problem for me.
And as a long time bread-maker, I usually add flour to liquid in my
Kitchenaid mixer w/o a balling problem. If mixing by hand (when making
biscuits or something) I do it the other way 'round. In a mechanized
mixer like the Kitchenaid, if you put the flour in first, then add
liquid & turn on mixer (even on slowest setting), it'll toss flour _all_
over the place.
So the answers is: It depends...
- --Paul
------------------------------
From: Dale Smith <des@io.com>
Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 08:28:01 -0500
Subject: Shiner recipe
Sam,
I've used this recipe several times with much success. As you probaly
know, shiner is a lager. They use lots of Maize in their recipe & not
very much hops. Overall, it's decent summer beer. It used to be my beer
of choice until I became a beer snob. They have a new beer out, an
unfiltered keg conditioned Honey Wheat Wiezen. It's quite nice!
Anyway here's the recipe I use. It's a bit hoppier & a little darker
than shiner but quite good.
5 lbs Aamerican Pale Malt ( Briess )
1.5 lbs munich 10L
1 lb flaked Maize
1/8 lb black Patent
1 oz Centenial hops (bittering)
1/2 oz Libertry hops (finishing)
Wyeast #2178 Lager blend
Mash all grains at 155 degrees for an hour
boil for an hour
adding Centenial a start of boil & Liberty after 50 minutes
cool quickly and pitch yeast
Since the lager blend is twice as much yeast as normal packs I rarely
make a starter with this one
Ferment 2 weeks @ 45 degrees
rack & ferment for 1 more week @ 40 degrees
rack into a keg & prime
set for two more weeks @ 35 degrees
enjoy!!
Dale Smith
Austin, Tx.
------------------------------
From: Don Trotter <dtrotter@imtn.tpd.dsccc.com>
Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 08:55:37 -0500
Subject: Re: doughing in and Starch balling
I guessed right when I thought that "starch balling" meant that the
srain would ball up and not thoroughly mix with the water. After
reading a few posts, I have decided that this may not be an issue with
small mashes of 10 gallons or less in volume. After reading Jim
Busches post "Subject: Adding grain to water," Tue, 20 Aug 1996, It
seems to me that the mash volume may contribute to balling. As I had
said in my earlier post, I add the grain to the measured and preheated
water, in Gott coolers. I have seen no balling yet, and I always mix
real well - until the grain is thoroughly soaked - so this would also
have the effect of breaking up the starch balls. If this is the only
problem, then it seems that it really is not a problem.
Of course, there is the question of denaturing the amylase with
excessive heat, but I see this happening either way.
don
------------------------------
From: zabarnic@saber.udayton.edu
Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 09:57:13 -0400
Subject: Announcing the Dayton Beerfest Competition
The Dayton Regional Amateur Fermentation Technologists (D.R.A.F.T.) invite you
to enter and participate in the First Dayton Beerfest Competition, Saturday
September 21, 1996 in Dayton, OH. This is an AHA and BJCP certified
competition.
Entries will be accepted from September 1 through September 13. The competition
is open to all non-commercial, home produced beers and meads. We will not be
judging cider or sake.
For complete information and on-line entry forms see the competition web page:
http://alpha.rollanet.org/~draft/daybeerfest.html
We are also looking for BJCP judges. If you are interested in judging see our
on-line judge entry form at:
(http://alpha.rollanet.org/~draft/competition/judge.html) or contact our judge
organizer listed below.
If you have any questions please contact:
Gary Foskuhl - Competition Organizer - (513) 277-3319
Bat Bateman - D.R.A.F.T. club president - (513) 845-0572 or
rbateman@dayton.csc.com
Mark Schmitt - Judge Organizer - (513) 236-4857 or
102160.1456@compuserve.com
Thanks,
Steve Zabarnick
zabarnic@saber.udayton.edu
------------------------------
From: KRAUSG <krausg@aa.wl.com>
Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 10:27:04 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Splitting kegged beer?
This may sound like sacrilege to avid home brewers, but a friend and I have
convinced a local distributor to order us a 1/2 barrel of an excellent
German specialty beer. We would like to divide this into 4 - 5gal Corny
Kegs (2 for each). We have both been kegging our own beer for about 2
years but have never tried to transfer beer from a commercial keg to our own
Cornies. The 1/2 barrel won't fit in either of our frig's and we live too
far apart to run to the others house for a pint. Is there a "good?" way to
do this and will it ultimately effect the beer? Thanks in advance!
Gene Kraus krausg@aa.wl.com
Remember: Never let you morals get in the way of doing what you know is
right.
*******************************************************************
------------------------------
From: Jim Busch <busch@eosdev2.gsfc.nasa.gov>
Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 10:35:37 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Dough in/Ofest
Al writes:
<Another problem is that with a fine crush and a thick mash you can lose a
<significant portion of your extract to balled starch.
I guess it depends on how thick and what is significant. Another factor
here is stirring well to mix the grain and water.
<Noonan is probably the most vocal about the risks of balled starch. See
<any one of this three books
After I read this, about 5 years ago, I tried it. Once. Never again.
My brew bud at the time thought I was absolutly crazy to try it once.
<The other reason that we would prefer to not add the malt to the hot liquor
<is because of the enzymes. Let's say you are starting with 180F water
<and plan to hit a target temp of 158F. You add a pound of malt to 10
<quarts of hot water. Stir till most of the clumps break up. Now the
<water (and all the enzymes from that first pound of grist) are at, say
<176F. You add another pound, stir; temp is 174F... Only when you add
<the final pound and stir will you reach 158F.
True but an extreme example. A 22F drop in temp at dough in is pretty
extreme in my experience. Also note in all malt beers how much excess
enzymatic power exists in the malt. If you are getting a respectable
yield by adding grain to water then stay with it. Its not that big a
difference, much more important is lautering and holding the right temps.
I guess Im not familiar with a Steels masher but if its used in UK
brewing Im sure Ive seen it and never noticed. At Victory and many
other US systems Ive seem, the grain falls down from the grist case
and is met by a spray of hot water, mixing as they fall into the tun.
About foundation water, there are many many brewers who mash in the
kettle and foundation water is a nonissue. This is how my pilot system
works as well as Victorys brewhouse. Its the single infusion UK style
folks who need to be concerned with foundation water. (or RIMS...)
Jim writes:
< To me a good Marzen/Octoberfest should have a low to
<moderate amount of Light Munich Malt.
Vienna and/or some Munich malts. I recommend a decoction too. Keep
the caramel malts to below 10% of grist. You need some, but dont
go too heavy.
<Here's one for you to think about: If black patent is a
<roasted malt, is Munich malt high-kilned, or light-roasted?
Its high-kilned but not until an extensive drying process is complete
at relatively low temperatures. The drying is important to create
amino acids and sugars that will undergo Maillard reactions to
produce melanoidins and Strecker aldehydes.
Jim Busch
------------------------------
From: "Pat Babcock" <pbabcock@oeonline.com>
Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 10:40:52 +0500
Subject: Re: Tollhouse Porter IBUs/OG; Shoulda brewed lagers
Greetings, Beerlings! Take me to your lager...
Had some e-mail regarding the IBUs and the OG of the Nestle Tollhouse
Porter recipe.
The IBU issue is an omission on my part! My hop utilization numbers
are fairly dismal 'cause I'd rather buy more hops than try to
separate them from the wort while trying to prevent my pumps from
stopping up! The "designed" IBU value for the recipe is 34 IBUs.
Adjust your hop quantities accordingly. And I apologize for the
omission. (Hope noone made a super-hopped batch in the interim!
The OG has to do mostly with efficiency, partly with the unaccounted
for contribution of the cocoa powder. I get excellent efficiency
from my Pico system. 32 pgp is typical for my system. Even so, this
is only 1.057. The additional points (indeed, if my efficiency was
off that day, part of the 1.057!) are most likey due to the suspended
cocoa powder.
If you're efficiency is less or more than mine, make the adjustment
to the base (pale ale) malt. Extract/specialty grain brewers should
be fine with the numbers cited (and that was 8.5 # LME _OR_ 7.5 DME).
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*
Interesting to see how many others were doing the wild thing over
the Thanksgiving season rather than brewing lagers! Recent visitors to my
homepage are already aware of the arrival of Jessica Rose on the
ninth of this month. This year, rest assured I'll be brewing lagers,
though...
Congrats to Brother Baby Brewers!
See ya!
Pat Babcock in Canton, Michigan (Western Suburb of Detroit)
pbabcock@oeonline.com URL: http://oeonline.com/~pbabcock/
Babstech Enterprises WWW Authoring Services
http://oeonline.com/~pbabcock/BabsTech.WWW.html
------------------------------
From: Kirk Johnson <johnson@primenet.com>
Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 07:47:57 +0900
Subject: Thunder Mountain Brew-Off
Hi All,
I would like to invite HBD readers and homebrew enthusiasts to participate
in this years' Thunder Mountain Brew-Off (TMBO) being held in Sierra Vista,
Arizona on 22 September 1996. The TMBO is an AHA sanctioned competition
sponsored by the Southern Arizona Natural Draughters (SAND). The best of
show winner will be awarded a $100 gift certificate from The Home Brewery
and TMBO trophy; 1st, 2nd, and 3rd place winners in each category will be
awarded ribbons. Entry information can be obtained from the competition
chairman, Paul Lachmanek at E-mail: paulgl@primenet.com, phone: (520)
378-4290 or myself, Kirk Johnson at E-mail: johnson@primenet.com. All
requests should include a return address so that we can mail you an entry
packet. Competition entries will be submitted in accordance with AHA
guidelines and are due by 18 September. The delivery address for entries is
Thunder Mountain Brew-Off, c/o The Home Brewery, 4641 S. Hwy. 92, Sierra
Vista, Arizona, 85635. We can always use a few good men and women: For
those of you in the Southern Arizona area who wish to judge or steward
please contact the competition chairman. Cheers, Kirk Johnson
------------------------------
End of Homebrew Digest #2154
****************************
